[Archive] 1500pts Dawi-Zharr

Creepy Dwarf:

This is the list i usually use with a couple of tweaks added:

Chaos Dwarf Hero - 94

Great Weapon

Armour of Gazrahhk

Chaos Dwarf Sorcerer - 150

Level 2

Power Stone

Dispel Scroll

Chaos Dwarf Sorcerer - 150

Level 2

Power Stone

Dispel Scroll

24 Chaos Dwarf Warriors - 319

Full Command

Shields

Great Weapons

War Banner

2 x 14 Blunderbussiers - 380

Blunderbuss

Champion

10 Hobgoblin Wolf Riders - 130

Light Armour, Shield

2 Death Rocket’s - 160

Earthshaker - 110

My main Plan is to March up the board with the warriors and blunderbussiers, whilst i bombard my enemy with some magic and shooting, the earthshaker slows down one half of the board whilst the wolf riders march block the other and/ take out enemy war machines.

Good plan/list?

Uzkul Werit:

This is 1500pts? I hope you don’t get stuck in combat for too long as I doubt that most of the list would be able to handle it. The list is decent just make sure that target any threats quickly before they get to your relatively weak lines.

Creepy Dwarf:

To be honest i dont really think my lines are “that” weak, a horde of hobgob’s yes but a unit of dwarf warriors and some flankers is enough to clear up what is left of my enemy.

Is it too small or is it becuase i do not have a bsb?

Draconis:

Mainly, it’s kinda of small.

A 1500 goblin horde or other mass armies will overun that no problem. I can fit two units of 20 warriors and 2 units of 20 blunderbusses with full command into 1500 points no problem, and have room left over for more. Put simply, that army just looks like it won’t stand up to a furious multiple charge, and that;s something you always need to be worried about.

Creepy Dwarf:

I see . . .

Chaos Dwarf Hero - 94

Great weapon

Armour of Gazrahk

Chaos Dwarf Battle Standard - 130

Armour of the Furnace

Chaos Dwarf Sorcerer - 115

2 Dispel Scrolls

23 Chaos Dwarf Warriors - 308

Full Command

War banner

Great Weapons + Shields

18 Blunderbussiers - 204

24 Chaos Dwarf Warriors - 246

Full Command

Shields

10 Wolf Riders - 130

Shields + Light Armour

2 Death Rockets - 160

Earthshaker - 110

Well i have cut out the second blunderbussier unit and swapped a wizard for a bsb, is this a bit better?

metro_gnome:

its better now… but you havent addressed the biggest point sink… the death rockets…

one death rocket in any list is too many… but 2 is off the map…

drop one and the great axes to get a unit of 25 orc boyz or sneaky gitz…

I’d change your characters to get point for a command on this unit…

put the armor of gaz on the BSB, drop the AoF…

give your general the enchanted shield and heavy armor… 2+ save, 74 points…

Draconis:

Wait…~Blinks~ I’m confused. How is 1 death rocket in an army list too many? I have GREAT luck with my death rockets!!! Since they work as a stonethrower they allow no armor save period. Yeah you may have the random factor with the hit and misfire both rolled at once, but still…death rockets are cheap and very nice for what they can do. Causing panic checks and whittling down units.

Now…I do see a weakness in that he doesn’t have enough basic units of troopers. Blunderbusses are nice in 1500 point games, and I can still field 2 units of 20. The complaint I have is that he doesn’t have enough warriors.

Hmmm…two sorcerors seem fine to me. Magic helps in a 1500 point game. But the 2nd list looks decent too, he’ll just be weak in the magic phase and against certain armies that will hurt. But he has more troops to use so that is good as well

metro_gnome:

death rockets are overpriced for a stone thrower and come with one less crew…

minty:

hmmmm, metro you seem to have a basic all use list in your mind since every bit of advice you give seems to point towards one list?

death rockets are awesome, they barley ever go random, it’s a 1/36 chance of that happening so whats wrong, since there the cheapest stone throwers in the game and kill alot but everyone hates them, your all fools (or only ever used armies with cannons and less random stone throwers) so keep them creepy

in 1500, 6 power dice works easily since the most ddice you will face without magic items is 5 (unless it’s dwarves but they suck) and why does everyone think you have to be magic heavy uber mage army to have a decent magic phase?. also, if DD are a problem you have chalices of darkness to lessen the threat, and it’s almost mandatory against dwarves,

BB’s work best in 18, maybe drop the power stones for an increase in size, also drop warbanner for this upgrade

you don’t need a bsb, all your units except wolf riders will probably be at Ld10 so a reroll isn’t necasary

metro_gnome:

there are plenty of lists that work… this one can be improved… and that is what this forum is for…

death rockets are not awesome… they are guess weaponry… and scatter weaponry…
neither the death rocket nor the earth shaker will ever make their points back in actual kills…
the earthshaker’s movement and missilefire hinderance more than makes up for that fact…
the deathrocket’s lack of crew makes it worse…

think about what this list does to a six dice magic phase… with only a moderate amount of defense…
it… shuts… it… down… so too shall your opponent…

If you don’t bring 8 dice, bring 3
- Olde Warhammer Proverb

Draconis:

Wait…never make their points back? Hunh!!!

Earthshakers have the added effect of slowing movement, no shooting from ground troops, and warmachines can only fire on a 4+. How the HECK do they not make their points back?

Secondly, there is a HUGE benefit to having only 2 crew. The machine is not slowed down at all if only one member of the crew is left. A death rocket can continue to fire every single round so long as 1 crewman is crewing it.

Three: I ALWAYS make my points back with my Earthshaker cannons and death rockets. My Guess is always good, I am 95% spot on with my guesses all of the time, and I almost always roll a direct hit with my Earthshaker cannons and Death Rockets. The addition of D6 wounds and Str 8 hit right under the hole makes it ideal for taking out large monstrous creatures that people field. In addition, whatever is hit by them does not get an armor save if wounded. Why is this bad? I am just confounded by your logic, and I apoligize but it…just doesn’t seem clear to me from your viewpoint.

Secondly, they use a Cannon misfire table. The machines are rock solid. Why NOT take them?

I admit your logic seriously confuses me. It really and truly does Metro. These War Machines are part of the staple of the Chaos Dwarf army and indeed our history…why not take them? They are awesome and for me, always make more then their points back.

Units work in conjunction with the army as whole. Not alone.

metro_gnome:

again… you sir cannot be helped…

Draconis:

again... you sir cannot be helped...

metro_gnome
Meh...whatever dude...I think I'll just happily label thee Troll and move on.

~Sighs, shakes head, and looks for an ignore button~

metro_gnome:

whatever… you’re the one in here trolling my sound advice…
in a thread that has nothing to do with you…
while offering nothing to the OP…

Mr. Pot I’d like you to meet Mr. Kettle…

Vodevil:

I agree with Metro on the Death Rockets actually, it really is just a overpriced stone thrower with two crew. Draconis, there isn’t a benefit to having two crew instead of three… Think about it with a three man crew you can fire at full speed with either 3 or 2 men and at half speed with 1 man. If you have a two man crew you fire a full with 2 or 1, but if everyone’s dead you can’t fire at all! The three man crew is always better, I learned this the hard way going from Dwarfs to High Elfs.

If you like the Death Rocket there isn’t nay reason not to use it, I use stuff that sucks all the time because I like it. However if you’re trying to archive maximum “power” you should probably invest in other things.

So about the list…

I was thinking about how I run my regular Dwarfs at 1500, and I’m thinking that three heroes might just be two many. Have you thought about maybe only taking a Sorcerer and a BSB? Or even just a Hero and a BSB? That would free up quite a few points, especially if you went Hero + BSB. Just food for thought…

Doombeard:

keep a unit of bull centaurs and use either the earthshaker or bull centaurs depending on your opponents force and what you think you will need, tailor your list to meet the demands of your opponent collect as many models as you can and dont worry about one set list. thats the beauty of the chaos dwarfs their range of units and troops is so versatile.

get as many slaves as you can for cannon fodder and cheap units a 30 /40 strong unit of gobbos or hobgobs will grind away and stand firm in the middle and your other more powerful units can maneouvre for the flank charges to back them up

metro_gnome:

i generally run 3 characters at 1500… you run out of specials pretty quick…
and I can’t muster more than 3 units of CD models… I run 2 characters at 1K…
i’m not sure the BSB is necessary… Draconis is right this line will hold pretty well…
a wolfboz with HA enchanted shield and sword of might might be more fun… and cheaper…

Creepy Dwarf:

woahh okay i wasn’t expecting that phew! anyway it seems that some people are in favour of the death rockets whilst other are not hmm well i think two wizards work better than the bsb okay he really helps but i need some magical defense, otherwise i wont have any combat’s for my bsb to be used for . . .

Hero - 94

Great Weapon

Armour of Gazrahk

Sorcerer - 150

Level 2

2 dispel scrolls

Sorcerer - 150

Level 2

Power stone

dispel scroll

24 CD Warriors - 294

FC

Great Axes + Shields

24 CD Warriors - 246

FC

17 Blunderbussiers - 204

22 Orc Big Un’s - 250

Full Command

Shields

Earthshaker - 110

Not as much shooting, filled out a bit more and a bit more fuller MC=92 which is ok considering the cost of Cd’s.

Better?

Vodevil:

Seems cool man, but I’d lose the great axes on the one warrior unit and use the points for more dudes.

This is really a personal prefrance but, I’ve been known to freeball it with magic and not take any defense at all sometimes… Try it sometime, wizards are expensive so you may find the points you save is worth it… Maybe not, but it’s something to consider.

Draconis:

Usually it’s a matter of what you end up fighting. I go against ALOT, and I do mean ALOT of Magic Heavy armies, so I tend to always take 1 CD Lord and 3 level 2 wizards in my 2k points Standard list with lore of fire Usually.

My personal opinion. Your line looks good so far. Looks like you will actually hold. Ditch the Great axes and see where you can get more points squeezed into some things. Maybe some Light Armor for your Big uns if you want to go the armor save route in HTH.

Mainly, we rely on our Warriors to hold the lines. I know that I am almost never going to get the charge with my Chaos Dwarfs due to my speed, even with my earthshaker cannons slowing things down. In alot ways we are just too slow. That’s why I soften them up with alot of artillery fire and force ALOT of panic checks throughout the shooting phase. The 3+ Save from my warriors in HTH alongside my Chaos Dwarf Lord attacking definitley helps.

But yes, overall the list is better. Ditch the great weapons and get light armor for your big uns if you can. That’s about the only change I’d make.

Draconis