[Archive] 2000 pt Chaos Dwarfs

Groznit Goregut:

Hi All,

This is a really difficult point level to go with, in my opinion. There are few options we can do. I am thinking that we just need castle up and use war machines. With that in mind, here is a list I am thinking of for a tournament in Jan.

Lvl 4 Prophet (Lore of Hashut) w/ Talisman of 4+, dispel scroll, and Enchanted Shield

BSB w/ Mask of Furnace & Relic Sword

Lvl 2 of Fire w/ Chalice

25 Chaos Dwarfs w/ full command & Razor Standard

40 Hobgoblins w/ muso, banner, shield, and bow

2 x Magma Cannons

Deathshrieker

Hell Cannon

Castle in the corner and blast away. The only thing that might be worth changing is going with two DS rockets instead of Magma Cannons. Mistake to go with no K’Daai? I don’t see how he fits in with a list that sits still. I’d rather do war machines.

nilbog:

You’re about 100 points over the minimum core. As you say, at 2000 points, it’s hard to fit stuff in, so why waste points on core.

This is 505 points:

28 Infernal guard, full command, lichebone pennant

20 Hobgoblins, full command, bows

I’d drop the daemonsmith to a level one.

You should now have enough points for another deathshrieker, or drop a warmachine and get some bull centaurs, or drop the hellcannon and get a k’daai if you fancy.

Groznit Goregut:

Hmmm…that does help.

I dropped fire mage to lvl 1. I dropped the magic banner on CD’s. I dropped a hobgoblin. That gave me the points for the extra death shrieker rocket.

Thanks!

Groznit Goregut:

So…I found out that I WILL get to go to this January GT in Columbia, South Carolina. It’s called Scarabcon and is in the middle of a full fledged convention. They TO had a death in the family and has been late in getting out the details, but we did at least get a snippet of the rules pack:

Hey Guys, I am helping run things for SCARAB. We are still finalizing the player packs, but here is the latest scoop or at least the main points…

- 2000 points, nothing banned no restrictions

- 3 games Sat and 2 Sunday

- Will use swede system to “seed” players (lists) with first two rounds using pods like SA. The goal is you can bring what you want, but you will play a list that is comparable to yours to start off. BB a couple years ago put people in soft/med/hard categories. This way you get control over this.

- We will use the 20-0 system

- You be able to score an extra 100VP (each) during every round for; killing opponent gen, killing opponent BSB, having a unit (probably core) in opponent deployment zone at games end, and for being the first to destroy an enemy unit.

- Game 1 will be “Pitched Battle”, core units will have close combat armor piercing rule

- Game 2 will be “Blood and Glory”, core units can re-roll leadership tests. Game will end when someone breaks. Only enemy units dead or fled will score you points. 500vp for breaking opponent.

- Game 3 will be “Meeting Engagement”. There will be 3 objectives across the center of the board. Each objective is worth 100 points to the unit within 3 inches with the most wounds (not sure if we made it core units only)

- Game 4 will be “Dawn Attack”. Burrowing (moving) objective appears at random location turn 4 and is worth 100vp as noted above.

- Game 5 will be “Pitched Battle”. Core units worth double VP

- There will be prizes for; Best General (I am leaning towards pure win/loss record with battle points used as tie breaker), Best painted, Sportsmanship, and Best over all. We are wanting to do second and third prizes for overall as well. Team prizes too.

– and I have a replica Samurai sword I will give out
So…2000 points is hard to do. There are some questions about the Swedish Comp for the event. Our last GT used the Swedish comp and bumped the points to 400. In normal Swedish comp, you aren’t allowed to go below 300 in points. If I look at the list I made above, I come up with these points:

War Machines = 35

Magic Items = 37

Sorcerer Prophets = 41

lvl 1 = 5

BSB = 28

CD’s = 15

Hobgoblins = 7

Magma Cannons = 36

Death Shriekers = 30

Hellcannon = 30

TOTAL = 264

300 - 264 / 10 = Comp score of 3.6!

I have thought about trying to be more friendly in the comp area. There is no Comp Score, but the first game will be against someone else just as cheesy. I know the Swedish Comp is particularly harsh on Chaos Dwarfs. What can you do?

Well, I made another list and I am wondering if I should take this one instead? Would it play better? I want to get more games in, but I am not sure how that will happen with the holidays coming up. I haven’t had a game in a month so far. Maybe I need to do Universal Battle?

Sorcerer Prophet lvl 4 (Lore of Fire) on Great Taurus w/ Charmed Shield and Talisman of 4+

BSB w/ Mask of Furnace and Relic Sword (and shield)

Khan on wolf w/ Biting Blade

Khan on wolf w/ Shrieking Blade

24 Chaos Dwarfs w/ full command

40 Hobgoblins w/ muso, banner, shield, and bow

3 Bull Centaurs w/ Great Weapons, muso, and Gleaming Pennant

Magma Cannon

K’Daai Destroyer

This army would have the infantry core hold tight and use the Magma Cannon as defense. Maybe advance, depending on who I am facing. The K’Daai, Great Taurus, and Bull Centaurs would move up on the flanks to smash whatever they can. The Fire Magic is there to heal the Taurus, shoot chaff/small units, and maybe buff a combat. I hope to use the Destroyer to try to block cannon ball shots (if I face any).

Sorcerer Prophets = 39

BSB = 28

CD’s = 15

Hobgoblins = 7

Bull Centaurs = 6

Magma Cannon = 22

Destroyer = 70

TOTAL = 187

300 - 187 / 10 = 11.3 ( a softer score)

Is that a viable list? Anything to change? The score is softer, but do I lose a lot of effectiveness with it? I would really like to get some serious input. I haven’t had a lot of games and it seems that the sit back and blast things with magic and war machines seems to be the way to go.

nilbog:

I quite like it, it’s not reliant on warmachines, and if you can include a destroyer and still get a good comp score then it’s a bonus.

It’s a bit more difficult to pull off, but with the taurus, BCs and destroyer, you can move pretty quickly. People might be surprised that you’re not sitting back shooting. Also gives you fast units for the objectives.

I’m assuming you’ve got a standard bearer in the BC unit? I might consider taking the +1M banner to make them faster.

If you’re not used to playing fast units I’d have a few practice games first. While the destroyer might be alright on it’s own, the BCs and taurus need to support each other and that means setting up combo charges, using the khans for baiting to get units out of the way and whittling units down with the magma cannon. Take on one unit at a time, crush them utterly and move on to the next.

Groznit Goregut:

I’m used to playing Orcs and Goblins and am quite used to fast units. The Arachnarok is a beast and on the same base. Also used to playing aggressive. I did an All Mounted list in 7th Ed that was very effective. Also was good at a Wyvern Lord. So, I think I can handle the tricky Lord on Flying Beast bit.

I just wonder if it has enough power? The comp only puts you in the starting bracket, but that’s it. So, I could go nasty comp and it wouldn’t affect me too much.

Groznit Goregut:

So, I played a game with this list:

Lvl 4 Prophet (Lore of Hashut) w/ Talisman of 4+, earthing rod, and Enchanted Shield

BSB w/ Mask of Furnace & Relic Sword

Lvl 2 of Fire w/ Chalice

25 Chaos Dwarfs w/ full command & Razor Standard

40 Hobgoblins w/ muso, banner, shield, and bow

2 x Magma Cannons

2 x Deathshrieker

Hell Cannon

I played vs Ogres. He had Tyrant & 2 lvl 2’s. There were 3 blocks of Ogres and 2 Stone Horns. Magic was terrible for both of us this game. We barely got spells off. It was either bad dice or Chalice (love it!). War machines took out a Stone Horn a turn. I’m thinking I probably should’ve hit the Ogre blocks. Still, it was impressive.

He used Hellheart and I lost 11 CD’s in the miscast. His General’s unit charged in. I held and my Hell Cannon counter charged. I barely broke him and ran him down. I was down to only 7 Dwarfs, though. One of his units flanked my Hobgoblins and they broke. His last two units charged my CD’s and Hellcannon. Spells and war machines couldn’t kill enough to save me. Prophet as killed in last round. Same with Hell Cannon.

I talked about what was good after the match and he said that the Hellcannon was a bit overkill. I had enough artillery and needed more bodies on the ground. Well, I think I have a good number of infantry…if I didn’t miscast! I think I need a K’Daai Destroyer. So, dropping the Hell Cannon and going for a K’daai. I had to drop a Death Shrieker for it, though.

Lvl 4 Prophet (Lore of Hashut) w/ Talisman of 4+, earthing rod, and Enchanted Shield

BSB w/ Mask of Furnace & Relic Sword

Lvl 2 of Fire w/ Chalice

25 Chaos Dwarfs w/ full command & Razor Standard

39 Hobgoblins w/ muso, banner, shield, and bow

2 x Magma Cannons

Deathshrieker

K’daai Destroyer

How does that look? I was thinking it would be great if I could get a Khan to help slow the enemy down. I’d have to drop another Magma Cannon, though. Worth it?

Is it hard to play with an aggressive K’Daai and then a static gun line? Or do I send it out on a flank (well, middle flank) and have it kill what it can?

Mike Newman:

Is this using the latest Swedish comp pack?

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/7619038/Swedish%20Comp%20Pack.pdf

As I think some of your numbers may be off?

Groznit Goregut:

Alright…a little more info came out for the event. The fellow running it had a death in the family, so there has been a slowness of official player’s pack. They are using the packet from Southern Assault GT (here in Charlotte, NC, US) which is an older list and starts you off at 400 pts. It means you can bring a nastier list without getting below 0. I’m not sure if they would even stop you from having a negative list, but just put you as the lowest comp in the system to play vs. the other lowest comp for seeding.

Now, though, I think it’s a matter of what I can get painted before the event. I might have to use my common Goblins as Hobgoblins for the event to make sure I am done painting in time.

Groznit Goregut:

The Player Pack is finally out for my event that is in 3 weeks.  I’ve retooled my list to fit the event a bit more.  Each round, you get bonus points for a few things:

Destroyed the First Unit = +100

Unit in Opponent’s Deployment Zone = +100

Also,

Match 3 has objectives that can only be captured by CORE units. Each is worth +100

Match 4 has an objective that pops up randomly that can only be captured by a CORE unit for a bonus +300

With this in mind, I don’t want to run a Khan on wolf as I think he would just give extra VP to my opponent in a match. Also, I want to split my one big unit of Hobgoblins into two.

Lvl 4 Prophet (Lore of Hashut) w/ Talisman of 4+, earthing rod, and Enchanted Shield

BSB w/ Mask of Furnace & Great Weapon

Lvl 1 of Fire w/ Chalice

24 Chaos Dwarfs w/ full command & Banner of Swiftness

25 Hobgoblins w/ muso, banner, shield

25 Hobgoblins w/ muso, banner, shield

Magma Cannon

2 x Deathshrieker

K’daai Destroyer

We are using the latest comp pack. If I count mine up right, I get this:

Earthing Rod -5

Chalice of Blood and Darkness -30

Sorcerer-Prophet -43

Daemonsmith Sorcerer -5

Infernal Castellan -25

Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard -15

Hobgoblin Cutthroats -3

Hobgoblin Cutthroats -3

Magma Cannon -18

Deathshrieker Rocket Launcher -15

Deathshrieker Rocket Launcher -15

K�?Tdaai Destroyer -70

16 wmp: -14

That should put me at a 3-4 for Comp! Good thing the comp only goes for seeding in the first 2 rounds!

How does that look? I’m tempted to put bows on the Hobgoblins, but I think I want to keep them alive as much as possible. I went with the +1 movement on the CD’s as I found the mv 3 really limiting. Also, I see me moving around a bit for the objectives.

Groznit Goregut:

I played a game Thursday night with the list vs. an Empire army. There were 3 objectives worth 100 pts and a bonus 100 for whoever destroys the first unit.

First off, magic was terrible for both of us. My Chalice made sure he didn’t get much off and my dice were rolling horrible. I did roll 12 for magic phase very late in the game, but it was too late to effect too much.

I did let the Steam Tank charge my K’Daai Destroyer. Part of me just wanted to see what would happen since it’s a practice game. This combat lasted a long time and my dice were really terrible for this battle! One example is 7 dice needing a 3+ to hit and only getting 2. Then, I only wound once. So, for the first turn, I only did one wound to his two and then lost another 2 due to instability. We fought for a few turns until his lvl 4 of Beast got off Transformation of Khadon and flank charged me. My K’Daai was destroyed at that point.

In the mean time, my Magma Cannon took his main unit of Halberdiers down to 1.5 ranks, which was pretty good. The Doom Rockets took out one cannon while his mortar blew itself up. After the K’Daai was destroyed, the rockets did a direct hit on the Steam Tank and brought it down to 2 wounds. I spent a turn not firing at it and firing at what was coming at me and that was a mistake. I did kill a bunch, but they didn’t break and the inf. charged all my war machines. I should’ve gotten the points for the Steam Tank.

Oh, one unit of Hobgoblins protected the flank of my CD’s and slowed down the infantry blocks from destroying the war machines for a turn or two.

The other unit and the CD’s charged enemy GreatSwords and detachment. Bad rolling kept it close for a while, but I was able to reduce their Leadership by -2 perm. I did break them and run them down. His Knights charged in. I was able to kill a bunch with my BSB w/ GW and Blood of Hashut. I didn’t catch them and they stayed on the table by an inch. They also rallied right at the end.

We looked up the points and I had an objective, while he destroyed my unit first. I did kill his General and had two banners. I barely scored a win with 150 pts or so! Crazy that I did so well as I felt as if I was losing most of the game.

Overall, I learned that a lot of my points are in my CD unit and I just need to keep that alive to have half my points left in the army. Sacrifice everything to keep the unit alive. That should do me well and it’s good to remember. I liked having two sacrificial Hobgoblin units instead of one unit of 40. Also, I need to focus my war machine shots on my appropriate targets to take them out, even if they die. Should’ve killed that Steam Tank!

Groznit Goregut:

Going to my first tournament this weekend with the army! It’s a Grand Tournament, too! We only get 4 of those a year in our area, so I’m excited. Here’s my list:

Lvl 4 Prophet (Lore of Hashut) w/ Blood of Hashut, Talisman of 4+, earthing rod, and Enchanted Shield

BSB w/ Mask of Furnace & Great Weapon

Lvl 1 of Fire w/ Chalice

24 Chaos Dwarfs w/ full command & Razor Banner

22 Hobgoblins w/ muso, banner, shield

22 Hobgoblins w/ muso, banner, shield

Magma Cannon

2 x Deathshrieker

K’daai Destroyer

nilbog:

Good luck, the list looks fine. As you say, keep that big unit alive and you’ve at least got a draw - it’s worth about 1100 points if you lose it in close combat?

Groznit Goregut:

I played my 5 games at the GT this past weekend. I had the tools to do well in each game…but didn’t. I will have to give a full write up later. I think I am not used to playing a defensive army and it showed. I’m also really rusty! Not many games in the past 6 months and with a new army…not good.