[Archive] 2250 ETC rules Double orcs!

Bassman:

Hello,
I’d like to show you my new 2250 points army list following ETC rules.

(in nuts: no dobule rare, just double special, max three cores with ranged weapons. Magic: 9 usable PD max, 10 usable DD max)

With ETC rules I found difficult to maximise our massive firepower (double earthshaker plus 6-8 bolt throwers) and we have to rely beter on our C&C capabilities.
I found Orcs very nice and funny so why not to try two blocks of them.
My setting is 20 of them full equipped with shield AND double choppa. So they could act with the double role of hammers and anvils.

OK, comments later… here is the list:

My good old sorcerer lord as a general, level III, Gem and scroll,

His accolities:
sorcerer, level II dispell
sorcerer, level II dispell

Battle standard bearer, armor of Gaz.

Troops:

24 steady “classic” warriors, full command, banner of slavery
15 blunderbusses
15 blunderbusses
10 wolfboyz, armor and shield
2X25 naked :o hobgoblins
24 naked hobgoblins (I missed one point for 25 :h )

Special:

4 bolt throwers

20 orcs, full command, shield, double choppa
20 orcs, full command, shield, double choppa

Rare:
shaker
5 bullcentaurs, heavy armor

What do you think? :slight_smile:
Bassman :hat off

Auretious Taak:

What are ETC rules? What’ this for? Print up rules here so we can better address it as I’m a bit lost. And why not Black Orcs in there? They do some real killing. And whilst you could focus ona shooty force you could go hardcore combat, Bull Centaurs, Lord on Great Taurus or Lammasu with a Dark Mace of Death will break one enemy unit in the game outright if you flank em so can’t challenge, plus you are all magicy as well, fire possibly works for a combat weapon. :slight_smile:

Bassman:

From Warhammer Forum http://warhammer.org.uk/PhP/viewtopic.php?t=44352

General army composition:
- Armies are 2250 points.
- No characters that are: special or Albion
- No DoW or RoR in non DoW armies .

- Rare choices may not be repeated, except for HE, where they can be repeated.
- Max. 2 of the same Special choice.
- Max. 3 of the same Core choice, except ranked infantry without missile weapons.
- Max. 9 PD/10DD usable *

*Magic description
You can use a maximum of 9 power dice in each magic phase. Each bound spell you use count as 1 power dice, all following bound spells from magic items, and only magic items, in the same turn counts as 2 power dice. For example a Treemans treesinging or Grave markers, only count as 1 power dice each time they are used, even if more than 1 is used in a turn.

All dice you would not normally regenerate, such as 2 gen Slann free dice, Skaven warpstones, night goblin mushrooms etc., also count in the total number of dice you can use in a magic phase.

Tomb Kings count each dice they use for a spell as 1 power dice and casket of souls counts as 2. They can not chose not to use all the dice when casting an incantation, for example a Liche Priest can�?Tt choose only to use 1 dice on a spell. You can how ever choose not to cast a spell with a model. The 2 basic power dice all armies get only counts if they are used to dispel RIP spells with.

Max 10 dispel dice per army. First dispel scroll (and similar working items) you have in your army counts as 1 dispel dice, in EACH magic phase. The second and all other scrolls, counts as 2 dispel dice in each magic phase. So if you have 3 scrolls you can use a maximum of 5 dispel dice each magic phase. Dice from magic resistance does NOT count in this maximum.

Race specific
- Max 3 ratlings
- Max 3 chariots (units of chariots)
- Max 6 goblin fanatics.
- Treeman ancient counts as Treeman

This a rulepack quite common in Italy, it was used for ETC in Modena.

qwe50:

It’s also the normal rules in Denmark.

I have played with rules like this or nearly like this for many years.

They are very good and take away most of the stupitty gw have made.

But renember they don’t balance power betwen lists - e.g Dark Elf is still alot better than ogres. Still they are very good rules.

Bassman:

It's also the normal rules in Denmark.

I have played with rules like this or nearly like this for many years.
They are very good and take away most of the stupitty gw have made.
But renember they don't balance power betwen lists - e.g Dark Elf is still alot better than ogres. Still they are very good rules.

qwe50
I like them too but, any suggestion? :D
Bassman

Auretious Taak:

I’ll have to read over them again at a later date, luckily my Hob Goblin Spam list is largely playable still, just means Death Rockets instead of 4 Bolt Throwers and maybe some Bull Centaurs or another 55 Hob Gobs instead of the last Earthshaker or turning the mages into actual mages for power.

To the original list posted, why don’t you try Black Orcs as one wedge? Also upgrading the Orc’s to Big 'Uns as the unit entry says you are allowed to so I am presuming the CD’s can have a unit of Big 'Uns in the list also? It would give you a very solid battle line.

Bassman:

Yes, we can have big 'uns and black orcs, of course.

I’m not crazy for black orcs, they are a bit overpriced, assumed that shields are mandatory, it’s 248 for just 15 full command! Too much.

I prefer 20 orcs full equipped, with double choppas and shield, full command each unit is 190 pts.

Big 'Uns are nice but fully equipped (shield plus double choppa) 20 with full command are 270 points. A little bit over the edge. I do not know what to get rid to find space for points… any suggestion?

I like the double choppas because they hit really hard, I like the shield because it’s only 1 point and could give you the needed protection against missile fire and, if charged by something nasty, they could hold on with nice 4+ armor saves.

I found them able to resist to many cavalry charges, stand and send them back to hell…

I could upgrade one unit but I have to get rid of the wolves… I do not like the idea… :hat mmmh, need stamina for my brain!

Are you going to change 4 bolt throwers with 2 death rockets? :o Do not do that! Bolt throwers are much better and cheaper, its 160 vs 120 points. I found bolts really effective. As you can see I get rid of rockets.

Bassman :hat off

Auretious Taak:

No, I am leaving my army as is, we don’t play by these tournament rules down here as far as I am aware, the 8 Bolt Throwers stay in my Hob Gob Spam list (game in aweek or two if lucky!), I was just musing out loud is all.

It’s a shame we can’t have savage orcs, a unit of savage orc Big 'Uns with 2 choppa’s is insanely powerful, use a big clump in my Orcs & Gobbo’s armies when I play them, and boy do they hit hard!

Have you had any games with the force yet Bassman so we can get an idea how it fairs on the field not just paper or the interwebs ether?

Auretious Taak.

Bassman:

It’s good you’re keeping your 8 bolt throwers… I always wonder why everybody is complaining about our bolts. Maybe 8 are too many, a little cheesy, but 6 is fair. If you compare it with the new armies… :hashut

Unfotunately I do not have time now for actul playing, I’m using the few free time for painting and converting… maybe next week I’d try to play.

As soon as I finish to paint my wolfriders and assemble/convert the second unit of orcs I’ll made some test matches. :hat

Regards,

Bassman

Auretious Taak:

See that’s the trap all hobbyists fall into, testing AFTER buying the army. Playinga few games substituted or with paper units works incredibly well towards gettinga refined army that can do well on the field of battle as well.

If you do play a game with Orcs and Goblins at some point, I encourage you to field a unit of 30 or 40 Savage Orc Big 'Uns in a single rank across the front of your entire army. Maybe shove a unit of gobbo’s in a single rank in front of them for some shooting cover. Give these crazies a BSB with Gorks Banner or the banne rof butchery whatever the one is that gives +1 Attack once per game and you can quite literally use this unit to engage those static army lines, the lines which have all the units in a dead even line as they advance. With 4 strength 5 each, your savage orcs will do wonders trimming ranks off of that entire battle line before they break, leaving your completed ranked units in the rear time to move in and finish the job on static Combat Res alone before any attacks are flung their way. Heck if you time it with Wolf Riders et al, you can even ride up a flank with the units causing more damage with this expensive yet highly interesting and beneficial ploy.

I should post that in the tactics section, yes I should.

Auretious Taak.

Bassman:

See that's the trap all hobbyists fall into, testing AFTER buying the army. Playinga few games substituted or with paper units works incredibly well towards gettinga refined army that can do well on the field of battle as well.

Auretious Taak
Yes, I know but I'm too old to play with paper units! Ahahaha :D it would be really a shame in my hobby store! :o
I'm more an hobbist than a player so I really prefer units that look good than effective.
That's another reason why I choose a second unit of orcs, my first one was a pleasure to build and paint. It was really effective on the battlefield as well... so why not give it a try for a second unit?
I got some free orcs from an ebay purchase (I needed more goblin/hobgoblins, who do not need more hobogoblins?), horribly assembled and even worse painted. Now they are in my stripping pot waiting to be butchered and converted.

Savage orcs are really nasty! I had to do with them some times.
Normally I try to not touch them and deroute them into a nice forest where they get stuck for a couple of rounds... that's a funny trick.
Or feed them with hobgobobbos... and destroy the rest of the army :hat off
But it depends also on my opponent's skills, of course! :P

Regards, Bassman

qwe50:

I don’t like orc’s in a CD army, but I am in much doubt on what else to take. Orc’s are clearly best with shields T4 4+ - that meen they are good at “not dying” but CD have another unit for that: Dwarfs with shields - dwarfs are a little more defencive WS4 3+save, orc’s are a little better offencive with S4 first round - still they are both defencive units who cant win fights on there own. When i look at you list i think you need a unit that can win on it’s own - you have many defencive blocks but none who can win front to front. I have tryed both big’uns and black orc’s and i find black orc’s best. So i think 20 Black orc’s (with warbanner) would be better than the 40 normal orc’s.

Auretious Taak:

Going off qwe50’s reasoning replacing the 2 Orc units with as many Black Orcs as you can (max it at 30 though even 25 factors in casualties from range/magic) and spamming up some units of cheap naked Hob Gobs as fodder cover/cheap flanking units and you could do some serious damage…I’m too tired to think right now and not even 9pm. Toodley Pips y’all, and check Snowman’s army thread as I left a response that I’d like feedback on, kinda partly hi-jacked his thread, lol.

Auretious Taak.