9th Age and AoS do not exclude each other if you use rectangular bases.
The new minis from Forgeworld are great, it is a pity that the smith is Warhammer World exclusive and Shar`tor is a little bit overpriced.
In not-competitive environments it should be no problem to include the Hellcannon or Hobgoblins/ wolfriders with goblin rules. At tournaments choices are a little bit limited, but not bad at smaller game sizes. Drazoath seems too have good rules, that is nice. I will test him against a friend of mine who wants to play in a 1000-pt tournament.
Since this is a deabte about who plays what where (mainly AOS), I shall endure to keep this civil though my acid for AOS is indeed steep.
When it first hit here in my area it was like watching the red sea part. Half just moved along to KOW or out fully. No 9th age in my area that I can see at all(if it is here its hidden away and does not want new members, because they do not annouce themselves at all). Yes yes back on point on topic.
What did happen here localy is a lot and I mean a lot of new players came and played AOS. Very few of the old players did but many many new ones. Over 20 at first, but then things started to slow down. I think the enite thing can be explained easily. But I must dash so another time for that.
GW was lucky they avoided edition factions (for the most part) unlike TSR/WoC with (A)D&D. While AoS is not my cup of tea I don’t begrudge anyone who wants to play it.
Honestly, I rather like the Age of Sigmar system, for what it is. The mechanics are simple enough for new players to grasp quickly, and I don’t need an app and a cumbersome rule set to assemble an army to play a game (I’m looking at you, 40k). Ninth Age seems to have addressed the lion’s share of 8th ed’s game mechanics issues, although its already going through rewrites and balance problems (the same problems the Ninth Age creators complained bitterly about themselves), however it also suffers from the issue Fantasy has had since 5th ed on: the need to field these huge armies just to get a decent sized game.
Played another game with them today - my second AoS game.
This time we decided to use general’s handbook points values, and we went for 1500 points.
My army composition;
Drazoath
Castellan (thanks @Ben)
Battle standard bearer
20 Fireglaives
Bull Centaur Taur’uk
3 Bull Centaurs
3 Kdaai
3 Kdaai
1 DeathShrieker
vs…
Dark Aelfs
His was an all mounted army, consisting of:
1 Dreadlord
1 Assassin
5 Warlocks
10 cold one riders
10 Dark Riders
10 Dark Riders
War hydra
Without going into blow by blow I’ll give match play highlights.
So, we both had armies with no hard bloodbound-esque obvious slap you in the face synergies. His tactics were going to be hit and run, and mine was very much hold the line. I got the feeling that when he hit, it was going to be hard. It’s fair to say we were both still learning the game.
I flew drazoath to a scenery piece in the middle of the table, and since he’s big and impressive (I was using my Kdaai Destroyer model as count’s as…) he was an immediate magnet. By turn two he was mobbed by the cold one knights. I made sure that the two Kdaai units orbited him like little satellites. He was reduced to half wounds, and I made sure that he was under mystic shield and rocket launcher protection most of the time. I also kept him under the sweep of the fireglaives and castellan and bsb’s range.
The fireborn, though not on the face of it great, caused four mortal wounds without even trying - to the unit of warlocks, the cold one knights, the dreadlord, and the assassin who could have torn Drazoath to peices were it not for some terrible dice rolling on his part. Phew! The end of combat phase free mortal wound to any unit within 3" of the fireborn was something I really appreciated, especially as I made sure that they flew in front and behind of units I wanted to target with this.
The fire glaives I think next time I will deploy near the end as I could have done with seeing where that hydra was parked. As it is, it concentrated all of its efforts on the bull centaurs who fortunately managed to get the charge in. on a unit of dark riders at the time. For me so far they really shine, with the Taur’uk pulverising the hydra whilst on his remaining wound.
The rocket launchers are so good at just being annoying - I used them to just heckle the hero’s and monster in cover
After four turns he had lost most of his army and I had lost two Fireglaives. Although hairy moment was turn two where Drazoath was befuddled on the terrain and basically had to just sit and take it.
Honestly, I love playing these guys. I love playing them as much as I did in 8th.
Looking ahead, I can see different challenges if I were to play things which synergise epically well like death and Khorne armies. And I think I can see me dropping drazoath and maybe looking to field more fireglaives and bull centaurs.
I don’t have a magma cannon in there yet and that’ll be next together with a dreadquake mortar - not for the wounds it does, but now having seen how stuffed an army can be if it can’t move, it’s ability to stop units from running isn’t to be sniffed at to my amateur eyes.
Yesterday a guy from nearby came to my home for spontaneous AoS games. We played 2 games 1000 pts each. He played a mixed chaos force with a Bloodthirster and lots of Skaven long range shooting units. Myself played the Legion of Azgorh.
I tried a few different things and found our war machines and the fireglaives in bigger units very strong. Against the Skaven long range shooting they were absolutely necessary.
In the second game I played without war machines and despite Drazoath hitting my opponents troops hard with a few spells and shooting he was catched by the Bloodthirster on a 9+ charge and killed in one go and I struggled against being wiped out.
Drazoath is very strong, but the flames of azgorh spell is a little bit unreliable as it goes off only on 8+. If he is attacked by a 200pts + monster or unit he cannot hold his ground. So probably it is best to keep him away from the main melees with his good mobility and focus on casting and mission objectives.
The castellan was my general. He has a rather good command ability and I kept him near my units as long as possible.
I thought I saw footnotes that said: o~these rules are experimental and might be updated... o~for hobgoblins use the goblins entry from the Orc&Goblins Warscrolls...
To respond to the original question: not playing AoS; don't know of any nearby club or store where it is being played much.
Tertius
Nope, the Hellcannon is this one. Technically you have rules for it in the Warriors of Chaos compendium, but its keywords say "Slaves to Darkness" and "Duardin", not "Legion of Azgorh" and "Zharr Goroth". Unfortunately, you can't have Infernal Guards as Battleline (the core of your army) if you include models from other forces, which also means that you can't proxy a Sorcerer on Manticore as a Prophet on Lammasu, and Hobgoblins as Grots. But I hope that Forgeworld has plans for these guys.
And Firehammer, are you serious? We have a steam train. Everyone here was drooling back when it was released. So, if Warhammer Fantasy had steampunk Chaos Dwarfs then it's "wow", but if steampunk Duardins are released for AoS then it's a disaster? Besides, I don't know if you remember this and this. Both models look pretty steampunk to me! And everyone loved/still love them. Come on, the Engineer even has a power fist!
Skink
You can't use Infernal guard as battle line but you can use units of skaven and beastmen "slaves" under the Grand Alliance Chaos. You could simply substitute those models with your hobogoblins. This allows you access to the Hellcannon, Great Taurus and Lammasu. You can actually build a Tamurkhan style army with Chaos and Daemon elements all under the umbrella of Chaos if you like.
You can't use Infernal guard as battle line but you can use units of skaven and beastmen "slaves" under the Grand Alliance Chaos. You could simply substitute those models with your hobogoblins. This allows you access to the Hellcannon, Great Taurus and Lammasu. You can actually build a Tamurkhan style army with Chaos and Daemon elements all under the umbrella of Chaos if you like.
Heavygear
Yeah, you could... But... You know, I was here before CDs were released by Forgerworld after years in a sort of limbo, then Tamurkhan came, I was very happy, and I built an army... You see, I don't want to settle for compromises anymore, I am way beyond that point! I want my Chaos Dwarfs, and I want to field all my models as such! I will keep playing the 9th age (which has given me SO many satisfactions so far)... Although I strongly believe that someday Forgeworld will release a "Zharr Goroth" book! When that will happen I will give the game a shot!
You can't use Infernal guard as battle line but you can use units of skaven and beastmen "slaves" under the Grand Alliance Chaos. You could simply substitute those models with your hobogoblins. This allows you access to the Hellcannon, Great Taurus and Lammasu. You can actually build a Tamurkhan style army with Chaos and Daemon elements all under the umbrella of Chaos if you like.
Heavygear
Yeah, you could... But... You know, I was here before CDs were released by Forgerworld after years in a sort of limbo, then Tamurkhan came, I was very happy, and I built an army... You see, I don't want to settle for compromises anymore, I am way beyond that point! I want my Chaos Dwarfs, and I want to field all my models as such! I will keep playing the 9th age (which has given me SO many satisfactions so far)... Although I strongly believe that someday Forgeworld will release a "Zharr Goroth" book! When that will happen I will give the game a shot!
Skink
No one said you couldn't play 9th age. I was just pointing out options. Since you clearly have no intent on playing AOS my post shouldn't offend you. All Forge World needs to do to make it all official is say that those supplemental units have the keyword LoA when played as part of a LoA list or simply remove the Battle line if part of LoA requirement. Not all units have those restrictions. The LoA pdf's were released before the pitched battle rules came along so an update would not be out of line. Not everyone is threatened by the ability to include other miniatures in their armies. Chaos Dwarves have always been a combination of Dwarf and Greenskin. Forge world added daemons to the list with the Kdaii. Nobody was ever playing a "pure" chaos dwarf list to begin with.
+1.
The greenskin slaves should get the LoA keyword so that we can keep the allegiance.
TheHoodedMan
You could argue since forge world tells you to substitute those warscrolls for LoA units they all ready have LoA status when played as part of the LoA. Goblins are battle line units anyway. FW could not have predicted pitched battle rules when they released those warscrolls.
Oh, it totally didn't :) . Probably my previous post soundad waaaaaaaaaay more serious than what I had intended it to be. And yeah, I want to play AoS, but only when I will see an update from Forgeworld ;)
Oh, it totally didn't :) . Probably my previous post soundad waaaaaaaaaay more serious than what I had intended it to be. And yeah, I want to play AoS, but only when I will see an update from Forgeworld ;)
Skink
I emailed FW customer service questioning the status of Infernal Guard in pitched battles if substitute units from Warriors of Chaos warscrolls are used. I also asked if goblin warscrolls from grand alliance destruction can be used in pitched battles. Here is their response so far.
"Greetings Mortal Subject of the Realms!
Due to the vast complexities of commands issued by our Sigmarites Erranda (the Rules Team) mere rank and file warriors such as ourselves are not permitted to respond to queries such as this, as detailed in 'Rules, Regulations, Conduct Proper, Codes, Practices, and Laws of the Great and Magnificent Realms of Humanity'
Any queries regarding your commands and lore should be forwarded to the proper authorities for review and correction where necessary. Communiques should be forwarded to the below address:
gamefaqs@gwplc.com
Note:Battlefield conditions can often cause communications to become disrupted. Should this occur, DO NOT PANIC, continue as normal until normal communication resumes.
Sounds very much like how things where back during and before 7th and 8th. I will keep this civil, but you have put yourself right back where you where before. Waiting on the whims of a company that already has stated they dont really care about the quality or rules they just want to sell models. Just my POV on the entire waiting for offical reply from some company who doesnt seem to care about the players.
