I have to say, Lore of Death is not a terribly good lore.
yes, it has sniper spells. But when an enemy is in combat, what spells does the lore have?
Soulblight, (which most people shut down asap)
Purple Sun (chancy)
doom and darkness. (many just don’t care)
Fire, metal and the amazing Hashut lore have better synergy with the list. Death continues to let people down time and time again. Even getting a spell off and then the roll of the d6 v ld/ tough etc etc is still chancy. And short range.
Interesting MSU list. that’s for sure. Relying on one lvl 4 is bold, but can be done. really risky if you’re planning on 6 dice monkey-ing the sun.
personally, I like his hero set up. could use a lvl 2 or some equip on the castellan (or he just said ’ set up as you like). The bulls are great hard hitters.
There’s really no chaff in this list, or much to deployment. A few eagles / skirmishers could set plans against it.
Would be interesting to try, but as stated above, I’d go metal or fire. (fire if on the taurus)
He is the host of the Bad Dice Podcast, which is the most popular Warhammer Podcast in the world. He lives close to Warhammer World and has friends at the company. He's involved in play testing and showing his army in White Dwarf. Ben is also big into the tournament scene and regularly wins first place at large events. He's a very good player and proper competitive.
I'm thinking that 6 dicing the big spells has a lot to do with it. It seems to be the answer for a lot of the big players. What does he do against high Init armies, though?
Death Magic has spells Direct Damage spells that can be cast if you are in combat. So, not too many restrictions.
Seems really light on bodies on the ground, though. Maybe that's why I stick with Hobgoblins, though...
In ETC format it was death and shadow lores that had biggest restrictions. And hashut!
Death is rly good at getting huge game advantage by killing general/bsb/mage lords, without this its difficult to win. Sniper spells work wonder on huge monsters, like Stank, Sphinx and warmachines.
Story behind this post is that I came across an old thread where an episode of my podcast was being discussed. I posted a reply to carry on the discussion and someone moved it to here.
I'm looking to build the list but will not be playing it for a while, i'm open to advice on which bits I shouldn't bother painting
It depends what you want to do, Ben. If you want a different & more fighty list (as mentioned in your podcast… I guess:
Destroyer, Iron Daemon (hellbound), 2 units of Glaives for the flanks and a bigger unit of vanilla infernals to hold the lvl 4/bsb.
If you want a more shooty list, there’s plenty of examples in the army list section. However I know you like the idea of double BC Heroes… So for more shooting may require dropping the “weaker” one.
Annoyingly for fightier lists a lot of the strengths of the CD’s, (I think) comes from a combination of the excellent war machines templating doom, with our units mopping up.
I would definitely add the potion of speed to the Lord. I dont have any experience with a list like this but I used to run a chaos dwarf sorcerer lord with death magic on a lammasu in ravening hordes. drink the potion at the start of the turn when you plan on casting purple sun, If you misfire the artillery roll you will be glad that your initiative is now 5 instead of 2.
Im going to try out your list at my next game. it is so radically different than what I am used to, Im curious to see how it performs. Ive played 40 or so games with the LoA chaos dwarfs but I still have not used a Bale Taurus, fireglaives, bull centaur renders or a Tau’ruk. Ive tried everything else though including the siege giant.
edit: Im a bit weary about the effectiveness of the fireglaives and the lack of protection on the BSB. might do a few changes to him and to also include the potion of speed.
Ive tried everything else though including the siege giant.
Crusha, how did you find the ID? I've recently done a total 180 on it, I think its super handy now. The shooting murders monstrous cav (very common recently) and with T8 Unbreakable it can block units that we simply can't fight (Gutstars, Bloodletter hordes, etc).
I tried running two of them and a Destroyer at 2400, and the look on my OnG opponent's face was pretty funny; I'll probably stick to a single one in general though.
Ive tried everything else though including the siege giant.
Crusha, how did you find the ID? I've recently done a total 180 on it, I think its super handy now. The shooting murders monstrous cav (very common recently) and with T8 Unbreakable it can block units that we simply can't fight (Gutstars, Bloodletter hordes, etc). I tried running two of them and a Destroyer at 2400, and the look on my OnG opponent's face was pretty funny; I'll probably stick to a single one in general though.
Baggronor
I like it a lot and think it is very useful but I have mixed feelings about it. on one hand I have an excellent tar pit. it could hold up just about everything in the game which is extremely useful. it's charge can be pretty devastating against anything in the game. it also is great at shooting monsters and multiwound models like you mentioned.
on the other hand it can be tar pitted very easily as well. it can be easily out maneuvered and it can handle some fast cav but has trouble getting through anything with a rider or bigger.
for the most part I like it but have recently decided to put the points to something else that can do damage less restrictively and just to switch it up every now and then.
Story behind this post is that I came across an old thread where an episode of my podcast was being discussed. I posted a reply to carry on the discussion and someone moved it to here.
I'm looking to build the list but will not be playing it for a while, i'm open to advice on which bits I shouldn't bother painting
Ben Curry
i have found k'daii fireborn and destroyers better then the bull centaurs. on paper it might not, but the 4+ ward and re-roll wounds makes them as tough as bull centaurs, and the everyone in base contact takes a S4 hit makes them harder hitting.
i know you like the bull centaurs, but try a few games first, i have been pleasantly surprised with my k'daii almost every game.
I do have to ask about the 6 dicing spells. Is that one of the reasons for going with Death? Purple Sun? How often do you think 6 dicing a specific spell is a corner stone of your strategy? What percentage of good players follow this idea? It’s something I’ve been meaning to ask you for your daily show. Just how important are the “big” spells to winning? What are the “big” spells that you need to have to win regularly? What about those army books that don’t have access to those big spells? Do they have a good chance of winning regularly?
Do your Bull Centaur characters go in the big unit? Or do they go solo?
It comes out to 2413 according to my calculations…
If he’s going for something that is easy to paint due to low model count, then he’s done a great job.
If he’s going for something that he might think about taking to a tournament, then it is frankly terrible.
So many points wasted on Fireglaives. No non-Fireglaive shooting. 5 deployment drops. Half the army is M3 infantry, and the list provides absolutely no reason for the enemy to close against them. No redirectors, no chaff. The Taur’ruks are tough, but are not stubborn, and are over 200 points each - a unit of goblins or slaves wins combat each turn the Taur’ruk doesn’t max out on damage (including stomps). Death is the wrong lore to take with a Bale Taurus.
Around here, this list would be outmaneuvered, picked apart and demolished wholesale.