Kera foehunter:
kill em all!! if they get in the path of the gun !!
Alan the evil:
Some more questions:
Can BB’s shoot without enemy in view (i.e. into a wood?)
Buildings and/or walls stop fire zone?
What’s up when BB’s shoot from inside a house or tower?
What’s up when BB’s shoot inside a tower with enemies fielded in more than one floor?
Thanks to anyone who’s gonna answer…
Thommy H:
Can BB's shoot without enemy in view (i.e. into a wood?)I believe they need a line of sight to something like all shooting.
Buildings and/or walls stop fire zone?Buildings do. Any "substantial cover" prevents a model from being affected. So if you were to draw the fire zone, and a house was in the middle of it, any models behind that house wouldn't be affected.
What's up when BB's shoot from inside a house or tower?This is covered in one of the Warhammer Rulebook FAQs. You count the width of the building as the width of the unit and draw a 12" box from there as normal. Additional models on upper floors count as ranks (so five shooting from the ground floor would be Strength 3, five [possibly four, not sure] on the next floor would make it Strength 4, etc.).
What's up when BB's shoot inside a tower with enemies fielded in more than one floor?I think you would just resolve hits against the models in the bottom floor.
BilboBaggins:
I still think they should be able to shoot hobgobs that get in the way.
BilboBaggins
so you'd travel miles and miles on short stumpy leggs, for miles and miles, and then shoot them :p most be verry demoralising for those guys that went on the trip to collect them:cheersThey are expendable. The only reason you take them is as Cannon Fodder anyway. You can't rely on the Greenskins because animosity hits at the worse time.
grupax
BilboBaggins:
OK, Chaos Dwarf FAQ Time:
Q: How do Chaos Dwarf Blunderbusses work with the stand and shoot reaction.
A: The rules are applied as any other unit. If the chargers start within the 12" then any model within 12" may be hit. If the chargers are outside the 12", the charging unit is stopped at the maximum range as normal - so in this case only the front rank of the charging unit is in the firing zone.
Now I’m going that the 12" is the entire templet (12 long x how many bases wide, I usually use 7).
The most logical is if the unit is mainly outside the firing zone the front rank only can be hit. If they are mostly in the firing zone then you can hit all models in the zone (figure which gives the most chances). Never had anyone complain if done that way.
Thommy H:
The most logical is if the unit is mainly outside the firing zone the front rank only can be hit. If they are mostly in the firing zone then you can hit all models in the zone (figure which gives the most chances). Never had anyone complain if done that way.No, the way it works is this: if any models are within 12", the whole unit can be hit. If none are (when the charge is declared, that is), you only hit the front rank because, as per the stand and shoot rules, the unit is stopped at the weapon's maximum range.
I think...
I'm at work so I can't look up the stand and shoot rules right now. Is it that you can't stand and shoot if they're less than half the weapon's range away? Under what circumstances is a charge halted by standing and shooting?
BilboBaggins:
The most logical is if the unit is mainly outside the firing zone the front rank only can be hit. If they are mostly in the firing zone then you can hit all models in the zone (figure which gives the most chances). Never had anyone complain if done that way.
No, the way it works is this: if any models are within 12", the whole unit can be hit. If none are (when the charge is declared, that is), you only hit the front rank because, as per the stand and shoot rules, the unit is stopped at the weapon's maximum range.First, your thinking is not what is stated in the rules. If there are models in the templet zone at the start of the charge ONLY those get hit, outside the zone don't get hit. If all models outside the zone only the front rank gets hit.
I think...
I'm at work so I can't look up the stand and shoot rules right now. Is it that you can't stand and shoot if they're less than half the weapon's range away? Under what circumstances is a charge halted by standing and shooting?
Thommy H
Second the stand and shoot isn't half of the weapons range but half the charge range. (First mentionin BRB is under Pistols pg 57.) Personally I think that Blunderbuss should always get stand and shoot, but my gut feeling that isn't the way GW wants it.
Now you guy realize that if your rank is wider than the chargers coming in you can roll the number of dice of your front rank and not the number of dice of the chargers front rank. You can only kill the models in the front rank though.
Do I have to email GW?
two_heads_talking:
Do I have to email GW?If, you are like most people that ask a question and don't get teh answer they want, they will keep asking until someone, anyone agrees with them. Then perhaps you will, but make sure to call them at least 3 times and write down all their answers as none of them will be the same.
BilboBaggins
Tarrakk Blackhand:
From the Rule Book~P.19
Stand and Shoot :
If the charged unit has missle weapons and all of the units charging it are more than half their charge move away (taking into account wheeling and terrain penalties) troops can shoot at one of the charging units as they advance.
This shooting is worked out just before moving chargers, during the move chargers part of the movement phase - refer to the Shooting section for rules governing missle weapons (see page 25).
If the chargers start their charge beyond the maximum range of the shooting unit’s missle weapons, their charge is interrupted and the shots are made at the maximum range of the weapons - the unit lets loose as soon as their enemies are within range of every firing model in the unit. If the volley fails to stop the enemy, the charge is then compleated, while if the chargers Panic (See the Psychology Section) they will flee from this position.
If the chargers are found to be too close to stand & Shoot, treat the reaction as a Hold instead.
HOLD :
A unit can stand fast and recieve the charge, representing individual troops bracing themselves for the inevitable impact. This is the usual response of troops who do not have missle weapons or are too close to the enemy to use them.
Hope this helps as I hand typed it.
BilboBaggins:
Do I have to email GW?
BilboBaggins
If, you are like most people that ask a question and don't get teh answer they want, they will keep asking until someone, anyone agrees with them. Then perhaps you will, but make sure to call them at least 3 times and write down all their answers as none of them will be the same.I should have put a smirk after that line.
two_heads_talking
Last time I called GW was when the Dwarf book came out. I asked about the points (and stat lines) of the Slayers and could I use them in the slayer army and the use of Slayer Axes in the Slayer army.
Their answer was I had to use SOC points and stat lines for Dragon/Daemon Slayers (same as the FAQ that came out) but I could use Slayer Axes (Which was contradicted later.)
Tarrakk Blackhand:
Must they ALWAYS stand and shoot, or can they open fire on anyone, charging or not?When I said this, I meant the enemy, (Any enemy unit within range, and not nessicarily charging) not my own guys. That only works with Skaven.
BilboBaggins:
Yes, you can shoot at any enemy unit within range when you aren’t being charged. :o
two_heads_talking:
I forgot to add smilies too.. lolDo I have to email GW?
BilboBagginsIf, you are like most people that ask a question and don't get teh answer they want, they will keep asking until someone, anyone agrees with them. Then perhaps you will, but make sure to call them at least 3 times and write down all their answers as none of them will be the same.I should have put a smirk after that line.
two_heads_talking
Last time I called GW was when the Dwarf book came out. I asked about the points (and stat lines) of the Slayers and could I use them in the slayer army and the use of Slayer Axes in the Slayer army.
Their answer was I had to use SOC points and stat lines for Dragon/Daemon Slayers (same as the FAQ that came out) but I could use Slayer Axes (Which was contradicted later.)
BilboBaggins
Tarrakk Blackhand:
Um…hope you guys appreciated me posting the rules! 
Thommy H:
If the chargers start their charge beyond the maximum range of the shooting unit's missle weapons, their charge is interrupted and the shots are made at the maximum range of the weapons - the unit lets loose as soon as their enemies are within range of every firing model in the unit. If the volley fails to stop the enemy, the charge is then compleated, while if the chargers Panic (See the Psychology Section) they will flee from this position.Yeah, that's what I was after. If they're outside of 12" (the weapon's maximum range), you resolve the hits against the first rank only (this is going by the FAQ). If any of the unit are within 12", you resolve it against all of the ones within 12". There's nothing about deciding if the majority are in it or not, Bilbo - either none of them are or some of them are, and you resolve it against none or some, according to whether they're within 12" or not.
Ubertechie:
the unit lets loose as soon as their enemies are within range of every firing model in the unit.This is the point that is potentially in contention - for a normal missile unit is fairly obvious - however for a BB unit does this could mean any of the following when being charged by a unit that is not either charging directly at (in which case only the front rank is hit as per the FAQ) or does not start wholly within the fire zone
Tarrakk Blackhand
1: when the back rank of the BB unit is within 12" of the charger
2: when the maximum number of the front rank of the charging unit are within the fire zone.
I favour the later as it is more in keeping with the FAQ whilst also following the current edition rules - however I am sure other people will see it differently and play it so - which I have no great problem with and would be interested in their reasoning for doing so
two_heads_talking:
Um...hope you guys appreciated me posting the rules! :Dhuh? What? rules? when we are arguing and debating? who needs rules?
Tarrakk Blackhand
wallacer:
2: when the maximum number of the front rank of the charging unit are within the fire zone.I agree. That does seem like the more reasonable option.
I favour the later as it is more in keeping with the FAQ
Ubertechie
Tbh, it's not really that big a problem. Most infantry will have to be so close to you in order to charge that you'll be hitting more than the front rank anyway, and most cavalry probably won't have a second rank to worry about.
BilboBaggins:
There is no mention how to handle skirmishers but my feeling is that if they were outside the templet you would hit as many models as you have on the front rank when they enter the firing zone. The reasoning is that they have to rank up to match your frontal area when in combat.
Kera foehunter:
yea kill um all!! then next time there move out of the way