[Archive] CD vs. new books

grunts:

Maybe this is the wrong place to be starting this thread, but how have everyone’s CD’s fared against the new armies (daemons, high elves, vampires)? Any highlight moments or wars which will never be spoken of?

I’m taking my army into the West Coast Mayhem tournament and I’m already expecting a majority of the players will be using the new lists. Any advice on how to stand up to the wave upon wave of cheese I expect to face?

minty:

OK, don’t panic, the new lists arent that powerfull, they look it on face value but everything has it’s weakness, and the new books are no exceptions

HE: there striking first, but more expensive than before, no offence but big woop, elves always struck before us, they where fast enough to get the charge before and most combats last one turn at best.

All He troops are fragile, and expensive. Warriors will be able to take on spearmen and pheonix guard eaisly, while swordsmen and lions can be fed hobbos to keep em busy until they get BBed

Vamps: They nether run, and they all cause fear. This can be a problem, but consistantly winning combat can take the game eaisly, so avoid the big unit of wights with the two vamps inside, shoot that unit instead, and feed it hobbos just like you do He elites, and engae the skelingbones and unspoorted units. Focus magic on wraith units as they are deadly to everthing, and when you have taken down his lesser units, tackle the vamp from all sides.

On magic, remeber to proritise, the necromancer spels are vital to stop, and the big hitters will be thrown in first to draw out dispell dice, trhen they’ll spam cast danse/heal which is the spells you need to watch out for.

Deamons: This is trick, a samall combact army that totaly owns in combat. Static res is your friend heer, as you have it and they don’t, and don’t engage the big wall block of plaugebearers.

DE: see HE

Auretious Taak:

Dwarfs, well dwarfs whilst not very new, are new compared to Ravening Hordes new, and it gets down to against more combat orientated armies, you get this massive bit of fun with blunderbusses, and hittinga full unit of dwarfs as they close, half get hit and bam strength 5 rapes em. Move away next turn fire rinse repeat and that’s a few rounds of death dealing awesome. Plus we get cheaper Bolt throwers and earthshaker cannons which work even better when you are point blank blunderbussing the slow ass chaps, lol. :smiley:

Auretious Taak.

Swissdictator:

I’ll comment on VC as I’ve played VC a lot until my picking up the Chaos Dwarfs. I’ll go phase by phase.

Movement: With the new rules of marching and vampires, they’re not as weak in this area… but they are still vulnerable. Remember the Varghulf IS a Vampire… so he might be used to let dogs march, I’ve used him for that before. Position yourself to use terrain somewhat, as that helps impede even the Vanhel’s… the Ethereals and Black Knights can still go through it though.

Magic phase. Yes, the key spell (especially for us) to stop is Vanhel’s… as that bypasses the Earthshaker side effects, though I might be wrong on that detail. However the best way to make VC magic weaker is force him into a position where he has to make tough choices. If you blunderbuss/bolt thrower/earthshaker/death rocket a unit to a point where you’ve done a lot of damage… suddenly he’s going to have to split his spells a wee bit more. That’s good as he’ll make less attempts at Vanhel’s or other spells. He either fails to heal enough to make up for the damage you did, or spends to much on healing and forgos Vanhel’s. A small skeleton/grave guard unit can be handled even being charged. So choose where you want to deprive him.

If you go two earth shakers/shooting heavy, Vanhel’s must be stopped. Our earth shakers REALLY help here as a VC player I need to close as quickly as possible with Dwarfs, let alone Chaos Dwarfs with their Blunderbuss! If you slow them down, you can afford to let one or two healing spells through. Remember, the first one or two healing is ok… make them pay for more… as long as it’s still a net loss between shooting/healing you’re winning that game.

In terms of shooting the weapons that worried me most are template ones. Why? They can actually do the damage in the mass numbers that will be hard or nigh-impossible to heal. Also the whole might get on my general. Let me put it this way… I take my blocks of Grave Guard in 25… I really don’t start to care until at least 8 are dead… once 13 are dead I know I need to struggle… as it should take 3-4 successful invocations to make up for. Combine this with Earthshaker effects… and you REALLY increase the chance to put a hurt on VC even with healing. However you may have to saturate a unit or two. That’s fine as usually only one or two units are the big threat.



If the Vampire general is in Bloodknights… fire away at it. Big juicy target that deserves to be punished.

Bolt throwers are a threat to a smaller degree, but only if there are several to saturate a unit with. However they are good at dropping knights… and they can punch through skeletons easily enough. Grave Guard are a tiny bit more difficult. Thankfully we can deploy a bunch of them for little cost.

Combat phase. Some VC armies do well here, others have troops for soft res/outnumber + fear. Some are more fighty, like mine (I had two blocks of grave guard and one of ghouls). We’re REALLY relying on T4 and good armor. A solid block (I like blocks of U.S. 25) will help as well. You need to deny this a bit, to allow the shooting to weaken them enough where hopefully we have a slight advantage on the static res. With the warriors you’re really banking on the ability of them to survive. Black Orcs and Sneaky Gits are nice little nasty weapon, especially if we use them to support the warriors as Sneaky Gits (let alone Black Orcs) can do enough damage to start tipping it in our favor. Basically stack the deck and hit them once they’re down from shooting.

Then there’s always the D3 wounds weapon of doom… suicide a flyer character in and hope it does some serious damage to the vampire…