[Archive] "Counts As" Armies

Hammerhand:

Morning,

the biggest problem I see with the "Chaos" counts-as-list is the base size. All chaos models are based on the bigger 25mm bases, whereas (chaos) dwarves are on the smaller 20mm bases. Chosen warriors with Great Weapon and the small frontage of a dwarf unit would definetly rock, though...

I guess counts-as-dwarfs is the best solution.

Cotter
Just use regimental bases with over hangs, as long as the frontage is correct, it doesn't matter how much 'empty' base there is either side of the unit

AGPO:

True HH, fair point. Oh, and I forgot to mention in any CA army you could use the dark emissary/truthsayer as a sorcerer

wallacer:

Does anyone actually do the “counts as” thing, or is this a purely theoretical discussion?

Hammerhand:

Does anyone actually do the "counts as" thing, or is this a purely theoretical discussion?

wallacer
You have to use CA for CDs in the UK GT.

Wow, abreviation-tastic

wallacer:

Wow, abreviation-tastic

Hammerhand
qft, HH. lol

Grimstonefire:

EMPIRE

LORD

Elector Count��= Chaos Dwarf Lord.��The fact that he can ride a Griffon (Great Taurus) is a bonus, but he can ride a Warhorse or Pegasus as well!��So some interesting fluff ideas there.

Templar Grand Master = Bull Centaur Lord?��He has to be mounted, so this would be a good choice as a ‘counts as’ model.

Arch Lector��Some real fun here.��I would use him as a ‘High Priest of Hashut’, not a sorcerer.��That he can ride a War Altar is an amazingly awesome conversion idea!!!

Wizard Lord = Sorcerer Lord.��Note that he too can ride a Pegasus (Lammasu)!

HERO

Captain = CD Hero

Warrior Priest = Priest of Hashut.��Very useful in gaming terms and interesting fluff wise.

Master Engineer = Arcane Engineer.��Lots of options here, a Mechanical Mount being one.

Battle Wizard = Sorcerer

CORE

Halberdiers = Chaos Dwarf Warriors

Spearmen = Chaos Dwarf Warriors

Swordsmen = Chaos Dwarf Warriors

Handgunners = Blunderbussers

Free Companies = Hobgoblins

Archers-Huntsmen Archers = Hobgoblins, Hunters = Sneaky Gits.

Crossbowmen = Hobgoblins or Chaos Dwarfs.

Knightly Orders = Bull Centaurs

SPECIAL

Inner Circle Knights = Badass Bull Centaurs!

Greatswords = Immortals/ elite infantry

Pistoliers-Outriders = Could be Chaos Dwarfs on mechanical mounts, or Wolf Riders

Great Cannon = Earthshaker?��Powerful bolt thrower?��Maybe even a single Death Rocket?

Mortar = Earthshaker

RARE

Flagellants = Berserkers?��Mad slaves?��Not sure what else would be good here.

Helblaster = Chance for a wacky warmachine here.

Helstorm Rocket Battery = Awesome Death Rocket

Steam Tank … Oh you know that would be good. ;)��A Kollossus maybe

SUMMARY

On the plus side you’ve got all infantry on 20mm, an amazing choice of heroes, loads of magic choices, more variety in core units than you could ever want and pretty much everything in our list covered!��Did I mention the War Altar awesomeness and the Steam Tank!?!? :o

You can also do highly themed customised lists because of the flexibility in the list (fanatical armies of berserkers for instance).

On the downside they all move too fast for Chaos Dwarfs on foot.��A major problem for a ‘counts as’ army.��The hobgoblins would also be uncharacteristically effective at what they would do (accurate shooting etc).��You would also have to have LOTS of models, because the core troops are so cheap.

ashur:

I actually used my CD as HOC ones. The only real advantage is that bull centaurs finaly act as heavy cavalry. Id still rather use them as CD. But is nice to see bull centaurs reducing entire elves units to pieces.

Hammerhand:

Great Stuff Grim!!! this is exactly what we’re after

AGPO:

Does anyone actually do the "counts as" thing, or is this a purely theoretical discussion?

wallacer
A few people have armies they can use as CDs or use the "in case of snotty opponent" dwarf rules as well

The empire seems most interesting, but don't forget hobbos have the same basic stats as men

wallacer:

"in case of snotty opponent"

AGPO
:D
In that case I would probably just use the regular Dwarf rules.

AGPO:

My pont exactly. As long as your CA army is legal, then you can have a game without wasting time arguing fruitlessly about the legality of the CD list

gIL^:

atm i use dwarf rules for my cd’s although i have grown apart from my chaos dwarfs.

i prefer my kislevite army WOOOO!

Willmark:

Or you just dont play against someone if they become a putz about whether or not CDs are legal. Probably the best option IMHO.

Uzkul Werit:

That never happened with me. Simply badger away at them until they give in.

Arlon:

who wouldnt let someone use chaos dwarfs there 100percent legal thats like someone coming up and saying no to dogs of war or hordes of chaos

insanity

:mad

Warlord:

Lords
Mercenary general - chaos dwarf lord (low T I kniw, but it's the best I've got) Can ride a pegasus also if you wish

Wizard lord - sorcerer lord with pegasus as a lammassu

Heros
mercenary captain - chaos dwarf hero (he's T4, so I guess it works)Can ride a pegasus also if you wish
hireling wizard - hobgoblin wizard (T3, so can't work as a chaos dwarf)
paymaster - hobgoblin hero Can be a Chaos Dwarf Demonologist or something because of the BSB effect

Heroes riding Warhorses could be carried by Hobgoblins or a floating palanquin

Core
Pikemen - hobgoblin warriors I don't think pikes suit at all
Crossbowmen - hobgoblin shooters I think Crossbowmen are too regimented for Hobgoblins
duelists - sneaky gits with either additional hand weapon or pistol
Light cav- hobgoblin wolf riders
Heavy cavalry - Bull centaurs With or without barding

Special
Dwarfs - chaos dwarfs
Ogres - golems/ogre slaves
LeadBelchers could be some kind of war machine
Halflings - small hobgoblins/ snotlings deamon potato sacks
norse bezerkers - crazed slaves/drugged hobgoblins

Rare
Cannon - hobgoblin/slave crewed warmachine
Hotpot - potato launcher crewed by potato sacks
Bronzinos Galloper Gun could be a Hobgoblin war machine pulled by wolves, or a Bull Centaur carried weapon
The Goblin Hewer could be an interesting weapon of choice

Regiments of renown
if you think I have the attention span to do these guys you should lay of the gin and tonic, just come up with your own


mintyMy comments / observations in Red.

In general, I find the DoW list the closest to the Chaos Dwarf List...

Warlord:

I think an Ogre Kingdoms list can work - but mainly because I see Bull Centaurs as a Ogre Class choice - and have mounted them on the appropriate bases…

OGRE KINGDOMS

TYRANT Bull Centaur Lord, or Chaos Dwarf Lord on Bull Taurus

BUTCHER LORD Chaos Dwarf Sorceror on Machine / palanquin / Lammasu

BRUISER Bull Centaur Hero / Chaos Dwarf Hero on Taurus

BUTCHER Chaos Dwarf Sorceror on Machine / palanquin / Lammasu

OGRE BULLS Bull Cenaturs w Hand Weapon + Shield

IRON GUTS Bull Centaurs w Great Weapons

GNOBBLARS Hobgoblins

LEADBELCHERS War Machines / Blunderbusses on Machines

RHINOX SCRAPLAUNCHER Demonic War Machines

GNOBLAR TRAPPERS Hobgoblin Sneaky Gitz

MANEATERS Really nasty Bull Centaurs

DOGS OF WAR Here is where you would get your actual Chaos Dwarf units.

HUNTERS, GORGERS & YHETEES Don’t exactly fit in this list IMO, but the Rare choices are better used for Dwarves.