[Archive] Combined profile

Rettile:

It seems that mounted characters will share their profile with their mounts. Personally i don’t like it very much because i know some armies will abuse this new rule, but what about chaos dwarves? Great and bale tauruses would make a prophet harder to kill in close combat if compared to a lammasu, but since saves should be shared aswell (tell me if i’m wrong) fielding a lammasu could be more effective than before, and he would also give the prophet magic resistance (3). And it’s still a wizard, less vulnerable than before. So, cows or lammasu? Discuss :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

Skink:

That’s a very good question, although I don’t think that we can really anwer it right now… We still don’t know to which degree the ride is going to boost the rider’s profile. I mean, is the Bale Taurus going to add 4 attacks to the prophet? Is Burning Body translating to the combined profile? If yes then the Bale Taurus is a no brainer… Is the combined profile going to be S6? In this case a magic weapon to add extra Attacks would be interesting.

If a Lammasu is taken is the whole model considered as a level 5 Sorcerer or, for the purpose of magic, is it considered to be two separate wizards?

So, until we know how the profiles will combine (ans we still aren’t sure if this is indeed going to be introduced in 9th) I don’t think that we can really discuss about the viability of Combined Lammasu VS. Combined Taurus.

torn:

If they are going to combine either their will be a lengthy FAQ and errata, or there will be some method of combining the profiles, a bit like with warmachines and crew.

pedneault:

Lammasu would be soooooo good with combined profile.

Malorndk:

Up until now, it has only happened to special characters during the end times. So I would say hold your horses and lets see what will happens in ninth edition, before going ham on the tinfoil hats :wink:

Baggronor:

Combined profiles is logical and very likely to happen imo.

It looks to me like the combined profiles come from selecting whatever value is the highest for each stat, except Wounds and Attacks which are combined. So Phoenix King Malekith is WS8 (Malekith’s WS), Str6 and T6 (from the Dragon) and has 9 Wounds (6 from the Dragon + Malekith’s 3).

So a Prophet on Taurus would presumably be:

M WS BS S T W I A Ld

6 5 3 6 6 8 3 7 10

The Lammasu’s rules would need an faq, and I’m not certain FW would bother to fix this let alone GW.

The Taurus Prophet becomes fairly tasty, especially with Burning Body, though in good old Tamurkhan tradition he’ll be far more expensive and not as good as other army’s monster riders.

Thommy H:

Yeah, I think a change to the core rules for ridden monsters is the most likely solution - they won’t need to change any profiles, just tell you how to interpret the existing ones.

Lammasu would be a bit difficult with two sets of spellcasting for one model though, yeah. Not sure there’s an elegant solution to that one.

Dînadan:

Combined profiles is logical and very likely to happen imo.

Baggronor
Doesn't seem that logical to me - why would the puny guy riding on a dragon's back suddenly be twice or thrice as strong just because the dragon is twice or thrice as strong as him? Or why would a griffon kicking you in the face make you burst into flames just because the guy on his back has a magic sword that's on fire?

Its more streamlined, but the only logic behind it is to try and drive up sales of models by making them less likely to die.

That being said, I agree it's likely to happen (unless their inclusion in the End Times books was just to test the waters and GW will actually listen to the player base if they prove unpopular *rollseyes* ).

I think in new books the most likely thing they'll do in new books is rather than giving monsters their own profile and have complicated rules for integrating them into a character's profile, instead they'll have monsters as a set of stat modifiers and extra special rules. Doing this would also help with FAQing existing books as all the FAQs have to do is say 'replace monster X's profile with the following' with the rules for what the new profile means being in the 9th ed rulebook if it is a 9th ed change or just a note saying 'refer to main rulebook Errata/FAQ for how this works' and said Errata saying scrub the entire Monster section of the rulebook and one or two lines on adding the monster 'profile' onto the rider's if there is no 9th ed for the time being.

Skink:

Its more streamlined, but the only logic behind it is to try and drive up sales of models by making them less likely to die.

Dînadan
Aren't you being a little bit unfair here? I mean, until a couple of months ago people always complained about the ineffectiveness of mounted characters. And now that the rules are being changed "yeah, that's just a sales move."

Dînadan:

Its more streamlined, but the only logic behind it is to try and drive up sales of models by making them less likely to die.

Dînadan
Aren't you being a little bit unfair here? I mean, until a couple of months ago people always complained about mounted characters not being good. And now that the rules are being changed "yeah, that's just a sales move."


Skink
Admittantly I can't really comment on the effectiveness of monsters because they don't see much of an outing in my area (although the guy who does use it has tended to tear through his opponents with it I believe). And I'm actually being cinical; I'm saying they're doing not to balance out the game or because it makes sense from a meta perspective, but because GW think it'll make them more money, because, let's face it, the more useless players consider something to be, the less likely they are to buy miniatures for it and conversely the more useful it is, the more likely it is to sell (to gamers that is - collectors of course couldn't give a toss about such things so will still buy at the same rate ;) ). Maybe being cinical is being unfair to GW, but considering they've started churning out big ridden monster kits and need to shift them because selling as many as they can is good business, it's probably not that unfair.

tenebre:

I like the idea… Mainly because it prevents insta death galore from cannons, which basically makes all big monsters useless. I feel silly hiding my super powerful tuarus behind stuff because he is scared of a ball. But if he is shown, he is dead turn 1. The extra wounds shared means they can survive at least 1 turn to get into combat or whatever.

We already house rule that you cant attack the character unless you are also on a large mount or similar size model. Found it silly that a guy on foot could kill Karl Franz off his dragon mount. Just made no sense.

dromar:

I think that the EOT is a harbringer of what’s to come in WHB9.

Magic will change, mounted charcater on monster will have there profile combined, it’s a good think!

I personnaly think that “flammable” will change to : fire attacks re-roll to wound against flammable models but we will see ^^

I can imagine a bale taurus prophet with M6 CC5 CT4 F6 E6 P8 I3 A7 CD10 SVG1+/4++ with blazing body and fueled by fire, would be great ^^ Oh i have 8wounds, you have to reroll to wound if no magical, pass my saves and then i can regenerate D3W each time i cast a fire spell on me…Lol.

Malorndk:

It’s not EOT (End Of Times)

It’s just the End Times.

Sry for derailing the thread, but EOT annoys me :wink:

TheHoodedMan:

I like the idea.... Mainly because it prevents insta death galore from cannons, which basically makes all big monsters useless. I feel silly hiding my super powerful tuarus behind stuff because he is scared of a ball. But if he is shown, he is dead turn 1. The extra wounds shared means they can survive at least 1 turn to get into combat or whatever.

We already house rule that you cant attack the character unless you are also on a large mount or similar size model. Found it silly that a guy on foot could kill Karl Franz off his dragon mount. Just made no sense.

tenebre
Then Karl Franz can`t reach a dwarf on foot also, or can he;)?
Warriors can jump, climb and slash exposed legs. Riders  even can unmount  and fight at the side of their mounts. Combat is not as static as the models.

Kaleb Daark:

apparently there is a very high likely hood that combined stats will be the norm for ridden monsters. Which is good for us.

However, my fears are that they are a band aid for the current artillery rules, and thus convincing people to take nice big fat ridden monster models, which players aren’t doing now very much.

But, and here’s the but, I wonder if the magic items or rules for equipping said character is changed then there’s the very real risk of the Tzeentch Chaos lord on a chaos dragon with a 1+ 3++ re rollable ward with 9 wounds which would just be horrible.

Geist:

I for one cant wait for a combined profile rule. A lord on bale will just tear shit up. Specially if you take the asf sword to cancel out elves rerolls, and a toughness potion. That would be a brutal combo against damn near everything. Then toss the blood of hashut on some 1+ armour save and cackle with glee when you tell them reroll that ward save from the other tricksters and they melt to death. LOL

snowblizz:

It's not EOT (End Of Times)
It's just the End Times.

Sry for derailing the thread, but EOT annoys me ;)

Malorndk
How do you know it isn't the end of times for some gamers...:hat off