I have found that a lot of Chaos Dwarf players don’t really like to field Hobgoblins in large number. Before, they didn’t count towards Core. Also, they are either expensive or difficult to convert. I can understand why people wouldn’t want to bother. Well, I want to bother. I am thinking that big units of these guys will be excellent to have in our list!
Here’s what I am thinking will be quite good to run with. Have a central block of Infernals of one type of another. Give them the Banner of Slavery. It makes all Hobgobs within 12" Immunte to Pscyh! That’s HUGE. If we can have our BSB and General within this range, too, than we are golden! The BSB and General Ld bubble would work well with the Hobgoblin blocks. They can be tarpits for many things and might even get some buffs/hexes (on their opponents) to help them win combat.
What to take on the Hobgoblins? I’m thinking two units of 50 with 2 hand weapons. They are still pretty cheap at 2.5 Skaven Slaves and dish out damage! I don’t care about protecting them and don’t have an opinion whether they should be horde or not. If not, that’s a big infantry block that will be hard to defeat. The ItP will stop them from running due to spells or magic. They should be Steadfast and have the General and BSB to re-roll their Ld 10. That’s a lot of attacks they can dish out, too!
If anything gets stuck in combat with these guys, it can be quite handy to have Bull Centaurs or Wolf Riders to flank the opponent and smash 'em up!
I think if you’re building an army around Hobgoblins wolf riders seem more than appropriate.
People seem to be saying Hobgoblins with shields and bows seems to be a good, cheap, and viable configuration in large blocks.
I agree that Hobgoblins really need some other source of models to get people interested in using them. I converted a single block of 40 and that was an undertaking. I think from a dollar cost-benefit perspective the only way we’ll see more hobgoblins is if someone like Grimstone sculpts some up to sell through Troll Forge or if there’s a general acceptance of using some other 3rd party miniatures like Mantics orcs. The old GW ones are just too pricey for these large blocks and converting requires a large investment of time.
Shield and bow are a decent choice. You can’t take both double weapons and bows, which is unfortunate. The shields are good for the parry save and good for just holding out. The bows can be surprising when you have a unit of 50 of them. In ranks of 5 you can get 30 shots. That usually gives enough to cause a few wounds to even the toughest of foes.
I like the idea of so many attacks, though! 50 in a horde would dish out a lot of attacks. The Hatred and any other buff/hex would really cause them to smash. The same idea with so many attacks, too, though. Some of them will get through. They probably can hold long enough to get support, but can probably dish out some damage in the meantime. Throw them against someone like Ghouls, State Troopers, or other Core units and you will see them smash things! An opponent that was 5 wide 20mm would give 7 bases touching for a total of 28 attacks at WS3 and S3. You give any type of buff/hex and you start to see some results.
As for Hobgoblin Wolf Riders, I don’t think I would ever use more than 10 or so. Either one group of 10-12 or two groups of 5. The bigger group would go to negate enemy ranks and hit the flank. Negating ranks is really important and will win you games. The extra CR is good, too. It’s a bit of points, though, to dedicate to a big unit, especially when they are Rare.
I think one of the small things going for wolf riders is that it appears the dreadquake, hellcannon and K’daii Destroyer are our main Rare choices… all of which are so expensive in an average game you could only ever have one of them. Like I said small thing… but anyone, after taking one of those three, who concertedly wants to spend the balance of the 500pts for “Rare” choices can easily take a decent number of wolf riders.
My opinion: wolf riders are really a special choice shoe-horned into the rare category just so the Iron Daemon could be move into the special category, thus allowing people to have more than one of WF’s large models in their army. They’re a choice you’d tend only take if you’d used up your allocation for characters, didn’t have room for a Kahn, and needed a relatively cheap cavalry unit.
If I went with one unit of 55 Hobgoblins w/ shield and bow and then 50 Hobgoblins w/ 2 hand weapons, I will meet my minimum Core requirements! I can just go straight to the unit of 30 or so Infernal Special Choice guys. Give 'em magic hand weapons and shields for the massive armor save and good S. Put the characters there. Get a Death Quake Mortar, Death Shriek Rocket, and a few other things to round out the list!
Not that it wont stop me from fielding two units of 40 w/no extra equipment. Shields are a waste if you can afford more models instead.
Smog
I dunno LA/SH combi + parry can be really handy against stuff like elves, empire and other predominately S3 armies. It will really increase surviveabillity and from experience cheap fodder holding up expensive elves can really frustrate an enemy general.
Well, I have about 140 converted hobgoblins on the go - so I’ll certainly be using them. FWIW I found converting them from Skaven (Monks to Gitz and IoB to ‘cut-throats’) to be quick and simple. It takes two evenings after work to finish a 40-strong horde and they are very cheap per-model…I think mine work out at less than 50c per hobgoblin.
I’m a big fan of cheap infantry hordes in 8th, and with throwing knives to stand-and-shoot they’re excellent.
I dunno LA/SH combi + parry can be really handy against stuff like elves, empire and other predominately S3 armies. It will really increase surviveabillity and from experience cheap fodder holding up expensive elves can really frustrate an enemy general.
Ugly Green Trog
The 6+ Parry ward save is good against any strength. If you want a big block to just be harder to kill, a little bit of armor and a 6+ Parry is the way to go. Sure, it's only 1 in 6, but they will probably be killing lots of Hobgobs and every bit helps.
I really think a horde with 2 hand weapons will be good, though. They are better than goblins and WS 3 and S3, so they will most likely be hitting on a 4+ and wounding well enough. I'm going to try the Plague Monks out with regular Gobbo heads (can't get the 40k Gretchin anymore).