klemanius:
Ive faced my friends warriors a few times now and got absolutely smashed. I almost had him once at the end of 7th, but I just can’t get the knack to break these guys. How do you do it? What units do you take?
If anyone’s wondering I play Indy GT, but Ravening Hordes players feel free to comment too.
richard barby:
whats in your list and what size do you play
Loki:
Also what does he take ?
rabotak:
well, one of my friends runs a knight list w loads of knights, loads of warriors and marauder cav, numbers depending on size of the game…
the only way i found myself able to beat him was to spend my points in bolt throwers, a tooled out block of 20 bcs (oh yes i know what youre thinking now) and as much metal magic as possible (1 lvl 4 and a lvl 2)… spare points are spent for warriors, bbs and sneaky gits… the trick is to guard your infantry with the bcs (use them as an infantry block) and smash into the knights after decimating them with bts…this worked for me twice now, its still way more difficult than it sounds (timing, positioning, luck an´all )
Lord maklai:
Well y’see warriors of chaos are like the necrons of warhammer fantasy; Its almost impossible to beat them in the department of killing.
Now against foes like that (not necrons though, they teleport) Is to get them into a secluded situation Aka use the terrain to do this, OR use a Very tough unit strong enough to survive their initial assault; then blow the crap out of them with guns!:yar
The_Bear_in_the_Hat:
I have only fought WoC twice since I started the hobby back up, but I’ve found that beating Chaos is the same as ever. You soften them up as much as possible at range, then let them hit a road block and then counter-charge. You can be proactive about it and go after them, but that’s not really in the Chaos Dwarf tactica for this one - it’s more an elves thing.
What you want is the standard ‘road block’ approach, with your elite units ready to counter. For your road block you will need: A leadership 10 general, a BSB and some massive units of hobgoblins. Your hobgoblin units will always have more ranks than the enemy, even after a round of combat or two, so they will be stubborn with leadership 10 and a reroll (keep your characters alive). Once your enemy is pinned it’s a fairly simple job to move your own shock troops into position to annihilate them, or to pick off the rest of his army. Witht he sheer size of your slave units it is annoyingly easy (annoying for him) to be able to deny other charge options to his meaty units - effectively forcing him into combat with your fodder.
You can actually deploy 2-3 big units of hobgoblins infront of a small unit of CDs which contains your general and BSB…your slaves will get all the benefits and your characters won’t have to get into combat and get killed by thqat horrible chaos lord. If you’re using that tactic then don’t tool-up either of those characters, but you can take some heros with save-denying weapons to cut through his knights. Doing this will mean your opponent won’t be able to just steam-roll your center…he will either get caught-up in your slaves or have to spend vital turns repositioning his units to avoid them - during which time you can shoot him to death. LD 10, stubborn with rerolls is as close as you’ll get to unbreakable horde troops; so enjoy. Just make sure you counter-attack before he eats through your rank bonus.
If he refuses to charge your blocks of 4 point hobgoblin troll slayers, then just shoot him whilst he moves or stands there and then you can pick off his weakened units at will.
Alan the evil:
2 earth shaker to make enemies slower (you can gain 2 turns of shoot and magic)
4 BT for warrior infantry (or cavalries if you can shoot on flank)
metal sorcerer lev 1 with signature spell and power scroll (usually is one knight unit smashed!!)
sorcerer lord lev 4 of shadow (for get worse his characteristis in HtH)
some small bait units of hobbos (… well, it’s useless to explain why)
Redhammer:
Actually, a chaos knight unit isn’t a bad target to hit with a BT, even if you aren’t hitting the flank. Each of those knights are 40+ points a pop, so if your cheap BT kills one its a net gain! Of course, if one also kills 2 or more chaos warriors its a net gain. 
I’d say earthshakers are the way to go. Slow down those pesky knights! Also, a BT (or two) on each flank could be a good way to maximize your chance of a shot on the flank (good against anyone, as warrior units will often be wider than they are deep). That worked wonders in 7th ed with my Dawi, and I’m sure the Dawi Zharr could adapt it and make it better with their cheaper (if less accurate/runed) BTs!
However, the thing that Chaos Warriors and Knights fear most is probably the Lore of Metal. Their grand armor is now working against them with Searing Doom, the signature spell. This also means you don’t need a lord choice, but can use the hero level sorcerer to cast the spell reliably against the small units of knights, killing d6 of them on a 2+. Not as effective against warriors unless they use shields (3+ with, 4+ without) but warriors can be dealt with by using SCR. Pin them with a deep unit of hobgoblins (or other cheap units. I think the Indy GT list uses rabble? The 2pt version.) and flank them with GW warriors.
Again, I have to say the key is earthshakers, IMO. Slow them down, and laugh as your M3 dwarfs become more mobile than any of their blocks!
Da Crusha:
The only problem I see with “Earthshakers being the way to go” is earthshakers in the indy GT list are not very good. the Earthshake ability was severely nerfed in this book.
richard barby:
if there running heaps of knight feed them some cheep troops try solwing them down with a 5 strong unit of wolf riders pushed to there side so they have to turn to face them but close enough that they cant move past and a second unit of hand wepion and shiled 5+ save and a 6+ ward save hobgoblins 50 strong 5 wide 10 deep keep them next to the lord and the bsb they will stick around for ages and the death star of the woc wont get anywhere and will get next 2 no points after heaps of turns
same time shadow magic earthshakers bolt throwers will hammer the blocks and maruder troops . you can trade off your steadfast horde of hobgoblins for bigger chunks of woc troops
Redhammer:
The only problem I see with "Earthshakers being the way to go" is earthshakers in the indy GT list are not very good. the Earthshake ability was severely nerfed in this book.Ah. I'm not that familiar with the Indy GT rules, so I'm thinking from a RH standpoint. I just downloaded the Indy GT book recently, and I'll try and take a look tomorrow. Hopefully I'll be able to help better then!
Da Crusha
klemanius:
He takes 2 17 strong units of tzench warriors with an exalted in one and a rather deadly lv 1 sorcerer who knows all your spells if he is in line of sight. this is backed up by knights, and 10 marauder horsemen with flails (I think) and a block of 6/9 chaos trolls, and a combat lord. Just for fun he pulled out Kholak Suneater at 2500pts and mauled the crap out of me, its revenge time.
Agreed on the rabble, they did a sterling job with the knights, to bad he smashed through my blunderbuss who got 4 rounds of shot into one of the warrior blocks and only dropped 4 or 5 of them.
I agree on keeping distance but on the stores 4x4 board its a bit hard.
Baggronor:
He takes 2 17 strong units of tzench warriors with an exalted in one and a rather deadly lv 1 sorcerer who knows all your spells if he is in line of sight. this is backed up by knights, and 10 marauder horsemen with flails (I think) and a block of 6/9 chaos trolls, and a combat lord. Just for fun he pulled out Kholak Suneater at 2500pts and mauled the crap out of me, its revenge time.Well, as already mentioned, Lore of Metal is it then :)
Redhammer:
I remember seeing some mathhammer back on Bugmans that showed Chaos Warriors will still outperform dwarfs with GWs, but IMO try should if they’re almost 5 points more each. You should be able to outnumber them, so a good flank charge after a unit has been pinned should give you the SCR to punch through that unit. Also, that math only matters in a straight up fair fight, so don’t give him fair fights! >:)
Again, a low level wizard with Lore of Metal. Tromp those knights, and even his copycat wizard can do so much against you. Lore of Metal will hurt you, but it will hurt him more.
The trolls are a hefty hammer, and that is a potent unit. Hit them with some flaming attacks (not sure how viable in Indy GR list, but the common banner can help. Put it on some GW warriors or maybe a Bull Centaur unit.) so their mutant regen doesn’t make them worse. Also, Kholek is a beast, but a good direct hit from a stone thrower will give him a nasty headache. BTs can also help in the “big nasties” department!
klemanius:
On the Indy GT Earthshakers, check the temporary FAQ (http://warmongers.ziggyqubert.com/wmbb/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=14931&start=0)
Earthshaker Cannon
�?� Change “halve their Movement value” to “halve their TOTAL Movement”.
Now that is a HUGE improvement, even with the smaller pinning radius.
From what people have said, I reckon I might run a unit of bull centaurs and a Daemoneater for counter charge and pick up some earthshakers instead of the deathrockets. definently going with metal and shadow.
richard barby:
as your useing the indy list go for some golums with lore of shadow and get them to slap the warriors around ( mindrazor works really well) along with the other shadow spells take the strenght and wepion skill of them and it easy pickings
as hes running trolls as well the flaming and magic attacks will knock out there regen