[Archive] How many people expect O&G to remain part of the list?

Swissdictator:

True, I could see them reposting units and such. They did it for Chaos Warounds in 6th edition. Plus there is a Daemon Prince entry in both DoC and WoC, which has differences.

I see regular Goblins being gone most likely, and I’d be very surprised if they were kept.

Border Reiver:

Honestly, I see hobbos being kept in the list as our “bulk out the army troops” and the regular O&G (including the BOs) being dropped if GW ever redoes the list (or they could publish Kevin’s list we’ve been playtesting for the last few months…)

I can see the rationale behind the BOs still fighting for the CDs (thinking fo the jannisaries), but in general I agree that GW will likely move to the the idea one army - one book. They did with Chaos, and we’ll likely have to follow suit.

Henroth:

I like only Hobgoblins and Gnoblars with CD’s.

The Black Orcs we betray he’s been centuries. :yar

Crube:

I can see greenskins of some sort being kept in the book, but they wont be the same as in the O&G book. Same models, but slightly different stats / rules maybe.

HobGobs will probably be the main ‘bulk’ troop…

All in my opinion of course :slight_smile:

Scion:

I think they should all be dropped apart from BO, they should just replace them with huge amounts of slaves :)! You can never have too many!!

Dhoom:

I think all the greenskins but the hobgoblins should be dropped. I want our army to be unique and not rely on another armies troops. Hobgoblins are numerous enough to fill out our slave armies.

Gundini:

I think only Black Orcs and Ogres would be strong anough too fight with Cd’s and the only ones theyd get in their armies because normal orcs and goblins would be useless for anything but the slave-pits.

fauthsie:

I would have to say that all O&G with the expection of Hobgoblins will be out of the new CDs book when it comes.

From a background standpoint

Black Orcs are too dangerous for CDs to use reliably in battle, they are rebellious to begin with and from what i know of CD background some of the most dangerous times in CDs history was when Black Orc (leading Orcs and Goblins) were rebelling. If you take black orcs out then standard O&G must also be out. That leaves Hobgoblins who preform many of the function of standard O&G.

From a practical standpoint GW won’t want to keep them in the list as many of you already have those models, and as a result people won’t want to buy new ones since no new models are that likely. Where as if they just leave hobgoblins and produce new models everyone will buy them, even O&G players who want to add flavour to their collected ranges.

Ammrik Gunrock:

Probably only Hobgoblins will remain in the list. I honestly dont care all that much if Orcs get dropped. If they do, I’ll just rebase the ones I have and start an Orc army, its no big deal.

wallacer:

I can’t really see a new list having slaves. They’re so important to the CD economy that it seems odd that they would send them out to die on a battlefield.

snowblizz:

I can't really see a new list having slaves.  They're so important to the CD economy that it seems odd that they would send them out to die on a battlefield.

wallacer
And yet that's what the DEs did. The thing with slaves is that they are expendable. You can always get new ones to replace what you lost. Preserving them associates value to the slaves, and I doubt CDs place any value on slaves. Besides that would sorta be the ultimate expression of the CDs wastefulness.

I would expect only Hobgoblins to remain in the army list, and frankly I'm OK with that.

Grimstonefire:

I think a slave horde depends on how desperate the CD are.

A 2000 pt army would have a fair number of slaves, but fluffwise I guess it would be less than they hoped to get back after the battle (assuming they won). But equally they could lose all the slaves and not have any to take home.

On the other hand, fluffwise the slaves in a CD army could be the result of previous battles they’ve fought to get to the big battle ahead. That’s my arguement anyway.

Lundi:

I find the poll options a little misleading, but I voted that Black Orcs would propably remain, but even then I remain skeptical that they will.

Regular Greenskins (not the Hobgoblins) are, in my opinion, as good as gone from the list. Including greenskins in the list to begin with was a lazy shortcut to beef up the armylist back in '93 and the fluff was made to accomodate that decision. In all likelyhood Chaos Dwarfs will get a Slave unit that is comprised of members of several races, but has a single stat line and ruleset.

Look at it this way. Let’s say that GW decided to release the Chaos Dwarfs, instead of just dragging us by the ears like they’ve done for 15+ years. Which will cost less and sell more: Referring CD players to a handful of another army’s units so that they sell more, or releasing some cheaply made but overpriced plastic model kit that encourages conversion jobs, therefore drawing in sales from more sources than just the Orcs & Goblins model line?

wallacer:

The thing with slaves is that they are expendable. You can always get new ones to replace what you lost. Preserving them associates value to the slaves, and I doubt CDs place any value on slaves. Besides that would sorta be the ultimate expression of the CDs wastefulness.

snowblizz
I don't really think they are expendable. Launching expensive slaving expeditions to acquire more makes it uneconomical to send hordes of them out to die in battle. CDs may not place any value on slaves per se, but they do place value on the work they do, otherwise they wouldn't bother acquiring them in the first place.

Thorne:

I can see Black orcs being moved into a additional dogs of war style army list and totaly out of the chaos dwarf army list completely. Taking the same sort of route that ogre kingdoms can be feilded in most armies.

Loki:

Iwould like to see black orcs staying in the list after all we did make them, but i think we can live with out the other standard green skins in the army

Willmark:

Black Orcs and hobgoblins could very easily stay.

Goblins are a goner, who uses them anyways?

Orcs are the problems as far as I can see, there are reasons for or against keeping them. I like them personally I think one of the things that make it so cool is that there are so many different force types in the CD army.

Border Reiver:

I agree that no one is acutally using a block of goblins as one of their special slots, but the question is not - what do we want to keep, but rather what will GW let us keep if they ever get around to redoing the list.

Chaos has been split into Warriors, Beasts and Daemons with minimal mixing (Daemon princes, dragon ogres, ogres, trolls and giants are the only ones to cross army lines), and I forsee GW doing something similar to us. there are arguments for keeping part of the greenskins with us, and we will likely keep the hobgoblins (they don’t play with the other greenskins anyway) and we may get to continue to use Black orcs in a special slot, but I don’t expect that they will be identical to their O&G army book counterpart. I strongly suspect that any option for magic banners will be gone (why would you give such an item to a slave unit?).

cornixt:

I can see Black orcs being moved into a additional dogs of war style army list and totaly out of the chaos dwarf army list completely. Taking the same sort of route that ogre kingdoms can be feilded in most armies.

Thorne
I hadn't thought of that, but the current fluff seems to suggest it is possible. Good idea!

Baggronor:

I feel Blorcs should be kept due to the fluff, but obviously they would be as slaves/mercenaries. No magic banners (maybe even no command options apart from Boss), maybe no armour, etc.

Hobgoblins should stay too, although I don’t know if GW are planning anything with the whole Hobgoblins-as-Mongols angle that they did in DoW. Personally I think that was an error and that the Hung should represent the Mongols.