kalz:
Ok, I cannot see a specific rule in any book about what a character is so as such here is my question if i put my lord on a lamarasu with shadow then cast a spell can i swap the wizard and his mounts ( as being mounted on a monster count as a combined profile) with my destroyer using the shadow lore attribute? I am honestly not sure if this would be allowed, but if it is 
evil laugh
Grimbold Blackhammer:
I believe if you look at the Smoke and Mirrors rule youāll find you can only swap characters around. Otherwise that would be really quite awesome!
Grimbold Blackhammer
Groznit Goregut:
Good question, though. Can you swap the lammasu for a character? What happens to the lord?
khedyarl:
Smoke and mirrors forces you to switch the same unit type. As the lamassu is a monster, I believe the lore attribute is actually completely worthless (there being no character monsters available to Chaos Dwarfs). I donāt even think that two Lamassuās could swap, as far as its written.
metro_gnome:
I donāt think this is strictly trueā¦ Lammasu and prophet together are considered a character with unit type āmonsterāā¦
Should the swap occur it would require the sameā¦ I looked at the Taurāruk and he does not fitā¦
but if you had another mounted prophet you should be able to swap them after a successful Shadow spellā¦
But as putting down that many mounted Lords doesnāt occur till nearly 5K its safe to call the shadow lore attribute next to worthlessā¦
kalz:
But the rules donāt state a specific rule for characters so whatās to say that the destroyer couldnāt be a character? he is a 1 man unit? 
i know i am clutching at straws but its kinda a competition we have round here to see who can use the most vague unsure rules
metro_gnome:
except Destroyers donāt follow the rules for charactersā¦ it cannot challenge or be challenged for exampleā¦
like I said you should be able to swap mounted prophetsā¦ otherwise there are no character targets for this attributeā¦
khedyarl:
Metro-gnome: They arenāt both considered a monster, and arenāt both considered a character. For example: A giant doesnāt roll on the big things chart against a Prophet, and a Lamassu doesnāt count as a character for items that get bigger with more characters around. They are seperate entities - one is a character, and one is a ridden monster.
I like the idea of playing ācupsā with a lamassu as much as the next guy, but as of now, I donāt see how it is possible.
metro_gnome:
Page 105 BRB:
"If a character has a ridden monster, the whole model is treated as having the troop type monster and thus follows all of the rules for both characters and monster models."
It then goes on to list a bunch of exceptionsā¦ and smoke and mirrors is not one of themā¦
Iāve only looked at the seige giant rules in Tamurkhanā¦
but it would seem to suggest that ridden monsters ARE in fact treated as āBIG THINGSāā¦
But I will check other giant rules when I get a chanceā¦
Far more evidence to support this swapā¦ and its relatively rare occuranceā¦
would definitely cause me to rule in favor of allowing itā¦
kalz:
That is what i was basing my initial decision on however as u say it is such a rare thing that never happens that rules are somewhat unclear hey at the very least get to have some fun discussing who is right
Da Crusha:
I believe there is a little bit of errata in the BRB FAQ about smoke and mirrors. cant remember what it is right now thoughā¦ probably doesnt cover lammasus ;P.
metro_gnome:
well let us approach this in a different wayā¦
suppose it is the character who is mounted that is a Shadow Wizard (which is more typical)ā¦
can we assume that this wizard may change places with some character (say the BSB ) on foot?
This could lead to characters who do not regularly have a mount option to gain illegal mountsā¦
you wouldnāt even need a lord level wizardā¦ a level 1 wizard could end up on a dragon through SaMā¦
I do not believe that is what was intended by smoke and mirrorsā¦ and I really do not believe it reads this wayā¦
If the character and mount are taken as a single model that is both monster and characterā¦
then the only legal target for SaM would be another character with the troop type monsterā¦
in Azgorh the only other target that would fit is another mounted prophetā¦
though I donāt think the type of mount (Lammasu or Taurus) would matterā¦
furrie:
When playing a storm of magic battle, you could change it with a greater daemon when you have made a daemon pact.
metro_gnome:
well sureā¦ and if you are using CDs as allies to WoC you could switch a Lammansu Lord with Galrauchā¦
Groznit Goregut:
Looking at the Shadow Magic Lore, it says you can exchange places with a character of the same troop type. A lvl 4 on Lammasu would make that whole model troop type MONSTER. So, as long as there is another character that has the same troop type, you can do it. For a pure CD army, that means youāll need another character riding a monster to make it happen. If you played in a doubles event at Adepticon or something, you could do it with any other character on a monster, such as an Orc Warlord on a Wyvern. You could also do it with an Ancient Treeman, as that is a monster and a character. You wouldnāt be able to do it with an Empire hero on Pegasus as thatās a Monstrous Beast.
So, I say it can happen, but itās extremely situational and not to happen in the average game.
It CANāT happen with a KāDaai as thatās not a character, only the same troop type. Itās like saying a Shadow mage on foot can trade places with a rank and file from a unit. It just canāt happen.
khedyarl:
Yeah, looks as if Metro is definitely right on that one. Which means a Lamassu with a Prophet on top can actually swap around with another prophet on a Lamassu, or taurus, or bale taurus.