RichardC1967:
I think I bought the last 2 batches of CD infernal guard with fireglaives from mamabigbig…two complete units for the same price as one from FW.I knew they where recasts and mentioned it the seller,they agreed to cancel the auction but I didn’t want bad feedback on my account(I have over 1600 transactions at 100% feedback as a buyer)haven’t received them yet, should be anyday now though.I have no trouble buying recasts, as a matter of fact, I’ll be recasting these minis for my own purposes, and building my army(not for re-sale),but there is a Chinese company that makes unofficial casts of GW characters for WOC(Throgg, Kholek…etc) and they charge a big price for them, I’m thinking about doing the turn about is fairplay and buying a few of them and re-casting them and selling on Ebay out of the US.GW’s miniatures are great, but overpriced, same goes for FW, saving money is important to me especially when I buy luxury items(i.e. toys, games, guns etc)and will always try to find the best price regardless.Once GW and FW realize they basically own the miniatures market and drop their prices, I’ll buy from them, but in the meantime there are too many “newer” companies producing nicer looking, cheaper miniatures and I don’t play GW tournaments anyway so I buy what I can afford.
Thommy H:
Lovely.
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Zuh-Khinie:
I think I bought the last 2 batches of CD infernal guard with fireglaives from mamabigbig..two complete units for the same price as one from FW.I knew they where recasts and mentioned it the seller,they agreed to cancel the auction but I didn't want bad feedback on my account(I have over 1600 transactions at 100% feedback as a buyer)haven't received them yet, should be anyday now though.I have no trouble buying recasts, as a matter of fact, I'll be recasting these minis for my own purposes, and building my army(not for re-sale),but there is a Chinese company that makes unofficial casts of GW characters for WOC(Throgg, Kholek..etc) and they charge a big price for them, I'm thinking about doing the turn about is fairplay and buying a few of them and re-casting them and selling on Ebay out of the US.GW's miniatures are great, but overpriced, same goes for FW, saving money is important to me especially when I buy luxury items(i.e. toys, games, guns etc)and will always try to find the best price regardless.Once GW and FW realize they basically own the miniatures market and drop their prices, I'll buy from them, but in the meantime there are too many "newer" companies producing nicer looking, cheaper miniatures and I don't play GW tournaments anyway so I buy what I can afford.
RichardC1967
Wow... just wow. I already had moral problems with some statements made in this thread, but you just found a new low.
If you want a cheap army, I suggest you collect Lego, buy/make cardboard figures or go Mantic... but please, for the sake of decency, make recasts as much as you want, but at least be silent about it.
Veshnakar:
I don’t understand why people think that the cost of the Forge World Chaos Dwarfs justifies malicious means to obtain them. If you can’t afford them then convert your own, or get the mantic ones. What they are doing is illegal. There may be loopholes that exist that make this legally okay, but that doesn’t mean it’s okay.
In the real world if you can’t afford a Ferrari, then you don’t buy a Ferrari. There isn’t a Chinese company making Ferrari knockoffs that are more affordable for people whole want a Ferrari but just can’t shell out the money for it because that would be illegal. It’s just not right.
I am not trying to hurt feelings here, but I had to sell every army I owned (about 4 of them, all fully painted) to afford my Chaos Dwarf collection. It ticks me off to the utmost degree that this is allowed to go on. I had to make sacrifices to afford them.
On the positive side, the recasts aren’t quite as highly detailed. I was able to compare the recasts to my actual ones seeing as a guy in my club bought some the fireglaives for his WoC army, so I guess you are kind of getting what you pay for.
cornixt:
but there is a Chinese company that makes unofficial casts of GW characters for WOC(Throgg, Kholek..etc)
Not unofficial, illegal.
and they charge a big price for them, I'm thinking about doing the turn about is fairplay and buying a few of them and re-casting them and selling on Ebay out of the US.
So not only are you buying illegal stuff but you plan on making and selling your own. And you feel justified doing this because it costs more than you are willing to spend. I just don't know what to say now.
RichardC1967:
I don’t buy or do things to make other people happy…just me…I appreciate and respect your opinions, but please don’t burn me at the stake just because you don’t like my way of thinking.I’m not here to make enemies, and if you feel offended by my posts then by all means ignore them.
Thommy H:
Okay.
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RichardC1967:
awesome…
This message was automatically appended because it was too short.
Method:
awesome...
RichardC1967
I understand Richard.
a large, large portion of people on
this board PM'd me for the recaster guy's website to purchase. It's pretty simple.
That said, i don't have any recasts myself (not that im opposed to them)
If i have learned anything in life. people aren't the same in the public eye, if you get my drift. put the recasts in a obscure local gamestore somewhere, for 1/2 the price. i'd bet more than half wargamers would purchase while in private. (shrug)
RichardC1967:
awesome...
RichardC1967
I understand Richard.
a large, large portion of people on this board PM'd me for the recaster guy's website to purchase. It's pretty simple.
That said, i don't have any recasts myself (not that im opposed to them)
If i have learned anything in life. people aren't the same in the public eye, if you get my drift. put the recasts in a obscure local gamestore somewhere, for 1/2 the price. i'd bet more than half wargamers would purchase while in private. (shrug)
Method
well said.. point taken...and my thoughts exactly
Animatone:
To All…
Taking the time to read thought this thread has been a conflicting matter, agreeing and disagreeing with both sides of the argument at various points. I’m still not quite certain who’s right on this one but a few things seem to be glaringly apparent and that is we’re all supporting China and what “we” (meaning residents of other first world countries) believe to be oppression by way of our collective economy(s), which may or may not be a bad thing.
Buying copied FW products can be considered theft, but the destructive implications many people believe to be so vile is that FW and GW will go under and no longer sell their product. But really isn’t this the same end result by a different method if everyone started taking the advice offered by various members on this thread of “counterfeiting” their own figures and molding your own CD miniatures? Oh yeah that’s right it’s not theft if you don’t sell your counterfeit figures, but will FW and GW’s profit margins, sales numbers and future product development be as healthy with this quasi moral solution? No… they won’t, because they’re not selling the product they otherwise would’ve if you had just bought their product as opposed to copying it, whomever you are.
What we all seem to be in agreement with is that copying something is forgery when there is the motive of personal gain at the expense or others, and that this always present motive is just that, personal gain.
Whether it’s your own personal gain by way of not having to shell out what you beleive to outrageous amounts of money to FW for a couple of models to finish off that Infernal unit, or some Chinese persons motive of making money by selling the same product for less because there are buyers interested in such. With theft in regards to commerce and trade the flow of money and goods is always of interest, but is that really what we are talking about hear?
It seems to me that just as many people on the forum site slave labor and oppression as yet another reason counterfeit mini’s are so appauling. As if we aren’t already supporting that very same thing when we shop at Walmart and buy our discount Chinese goods from citizens that can’t openly vote, or better yet when we buy gas/petrol from OPEC nations that still don’t allow women to attend school or show their face in public. Cultural bias aside both of these appalling social practices mentioned are far from the notion of freedom and more easily likened to slavery then the alternative. So aren’t we to blame then if we support this, and better yet are we really even supporting this continued slavery? Or are we unknowingly working at potentially ending it?
No one can argue that more people in China are working now and earning a living wage, going to school, supporting their families and finally having a taste of what we decadent and civilized few take for granted. If GW and FW have to hand out some pink slips, scale back their products and pay workers a little less to be competitive in a globalized economy I don’t necessarily see it as a bad thing when we now have new workers added to the world economy, who just so happen to be in China. After all that’s what happened to Ford, and they seem to now more then ever have their act together for the first time in decades, and all the while over 300,000,000 Chinese are considered middle class and employed and now buying Ford products. Who would have thought?
I find it hard to believe that someone or something won’t rise in the wake of a toppled miniature company if GW should fall, and wouldn’t it be serendipitous if it happened to be a Chinese start up. Either way I think we’re all looking at what’s happening through the lense of our comfortable lives, where work weeks are 40 hours, labor unions are present and workers have rights and happen to be over the age of 18, but that’s something even we had to fight for tooth and nail for over the course of a couple hundred or so years to achieve. So why is current Chinese labor practice so disturbing when it so closely resembled our own previous work state at a not too distant time? But what got us where we are today, so enlightened, so aware, and how will the Chinese catch up to speed?
The one thing that I beleived helped us get there was the incremental improvements in our lives due to our collective economy that allowed us to both invision and achieve a better life for ourselves and our familes. I think having more educated, working and empowered people in the world, especially in countries where there have otherwise yet to be is a good thing for everyone, not just gamers, and not just in America and Europe. So once again, I choose not to support counterfeit miniatures, but I’m still painfully aware that millions more Chinese citizens are impoverished and starving then I’d be comfortable with if I had to live next to them in that country, and I do gain a bit of joy from knowing these people are in a position not too different then we were in not too long ago… Let’s just hope they take it all the way to their government when they now can think about free speech and elections, instead of where their next meal will come from, as they wait… desperate, ignorant and poor.
But still I do feel conflicted in this, as I’m sure many of us do.
Not a single person mentioned Walmart’s and OPEC in this whole socioeconomic and moral debate.
rpitts2004:
I think I bought the last 2 batches of CD infernal guard with fireglaives from mamabigbig..two complete units for the same price as one from FW.I knew they where recasts and mentioned it the seller,they agreed to cancel the auction but I didn't want bad feedback on my account(I have over 1600 transactions at 100% feedback as a buyer)haven't received them yet, should be anyday now though.I have no trouble buying recasts, as a matter of fact, I'll be recasting these minis for my own purposes, and building my army(not for re-sale),but there is a Chinese company that makes unofficial casts of GW characters for WOC(Throgg, Kholek..etc) and they charge a big price for them, I'm thinking about doing the turn about is fairplay and buying a few of them and re-casting them and selling on Ebay out of the US.GW's miniatures are great, but overpriced, same goes for FW, saving money is important to me especially when I buy luxury items(i.e. toys, games, guns etc)and will always try to find the best price regardless.Once GW and FW realize they basically own the miniatures market and drop their prices, I'll buy from them, but in the meantime there are too many "oinewer" companies producing nicer looking, cheaper miniatures and I don't play GW tournaments anyway so I buy what I can afford.
RichardC1967
Selling counterfeit or fake items is against ebays policy so buyer protection would screw you if someone opened a case. Plus its illegal in the usa china has certain laws and protection on that. Also you cant get negative as a buyer.
RichardC1967:
I think I bought the last 2 batches of CD infernal guard with fireglaives from mamabigbig..two complete units for the same price as one from FW.I knew they where recasts and mentioned it the seller,they agreed to cancel the auction but I didn't want bad feedback on my account(I have over 1600 transactions at 100% feedback as a buyer)haven't received them yet, should be anyday now though.I have no trouble buying recasts, as a matter of fact, I'll be recasting these minis for my own purposes, and building my army(not for re-sale),but there is a Chinese company that makes unofficial casts of GW characters for WOC(Throgg, Kholek..etc) and they charge a big price for them, I'm thinking about doing the turn about is fairplay and buying a few of them and re-casting them and selling on Ebay out of the US.GW's miniatures are great, but overpriced, same goes for FW, saving money is important to me especially when I buy luxury items(i.e. toys, games, guns etc)and will always try to find the best price regardless.Once GW and FW realize they basically own the miniatures market and drop their prices, I'll buy from them, but in the meantime there are too many companies producing nicer looking, cheaper miniatures and I don't play GW tournaments anyway so I buy what I can afford.
RichardC1967
Selling counterfeit or fake items is against ebays policy so buyer protection would screw you if someone opened a case. Plus its illegal in the usa china has certain laws and protection on that. Also you cant get negative as a buyer.
rpitts2004
haven't sold any yet , just said I was thinking about it..it was said in the heat of the moment, just like when someone messes with you and you tell them "I'll kill you if you do that again"..etc..doesn't really mean you're gonna kill someone..
rabotak:
I think you should rethink your sig then…
khedyarl:
This thread keeps getting weirder, and more surreal. Can we get a mod to lock it, and lock any further recast commentary whatsoever?
gIL^:
This thread keeps getting weirder, and more surreal. Can we get a mod to lock it, and lock any further recast commentary whatsoever?
khedyarl
If it gets locked now the topic will just spill over into other threads best to keep it open.
RichardC1967:
I think you should rethink your sig then....
rabotak
great idea..what do you think of my new signature?
RichardC1967:
This thread keeps getting weirder, and more surreal. Can we get a mod to lock it, and lock any further recast commentary whatsoever?
khedyarl
If it gets locked now the topic will just spill over into other threads best to keep it open.
gIL^
I'll stop posting if everyone else stops fanning the fire...
Kera foehunter:
we are no longer on topic and on the verge of breaking the rules of the site
TROLLING
Trolling, much like the beast itself is ugly and unpleasant. It�?Ts why the vast majority of forums are dead against it (some being a lot more harsh than others), and have forums rules against it. CDO is no different.
But what actually is it I hear you ask? Trolling is posting in an unnecessarily argumentative or confrontational way, often about any old thing. Just for the fun of it.
FLAMING
Flaming, much like it�?Ts obvious connotations are inflammatory. This means that people are posting in such a way as to be argumentative, unreasonable, objectionable or confrontational in the extreme, and as a direct result of their actions are encouraging others to become hostile.
seeing that a few of you are new this is why i posted the rules
Kera
RichardC1967:
This thread keeps getting weirder, and more surreal. Can we get a mod to lock it, and lock any further recast commentary whatsoever?
khedyarl
If it gets locked now the topic will just spill over into other threads best to keep it open.
gIL^
I'll stop posting if everyone else stops fanning the fire...
RichardC1967
You are one piece of work =)
rpitts2004
still fanning the fire I see....