[Archive] Maelstrom No Longer Selling To ROW

aka_mythos:

I don’t think Maelestrom or most online retailers are necessarily that sophisticated. I think what’s more likely to raise eyebrows is if you’re doing this for too many people… that the shipping address will be different from the billing addresses. You’ll end up looking like a credit card theif with a major GW addiction.

Grimstonefire:

Hmm… Just had an idea.

If you could redirect the IP someone in australia say could order through maelstrom but have only the invoice posted to a UK address (as opposed to having the payment from the UK).  The invoice would be in a different name though to the person who paid for it.  Would look quite fishy though.

aka_mythos:

The trick is to just have anyone who isn’t obliged to follow GW’s terms of sale sell you the miniatures. It can be nearly any retailer not buying directly from GW.

Willmark:

Artificial price controls and/or restraints of trade rarely work. I see what they are trying to accomplish I just don’t think it’s going to work out as planned.

cornixt:

If I read this correctly, this only affects GW products. More and more companies are already stepping in with their own cheaper models, and now GW are actively creating voids for them to flourish in!

Looks like GW are aiming for the premium market, which might work for young adults but not so much for teenage boys with limited cash when it comes to building an army. Pre-painted armies can’t be far off now, that’s going to be the next avenue.

nitroglysarine:

I imagine a lot of people will be trying to order through a person they know in the EU/US and have it redirected.

Grimstonefire
I for one would be happy to act as a conduit.
Although will the shipping site still work if you are on an non-uk isp?
not to sure on the workings of using a site from another country, but I recall someone mentioning you can block some countries from it.

But in that case I guess you could get someone to order it for you in the uk, receive it, then re-post it.


nitroglysarine
You can always use a site like http://hidemyass.com/ to circumvent an ip blocking.


Pyro Stick
Cool site, and i'm loving the site name!

Grimstonefire:

I wonder what Maelstrom will do if someone from australia orders say £100 of GW models and £1 of non GW models… Are they obliged to turn down the sale now? Or can they still ship it out I wonder?

Pyro Stick:

More information on the specifics will probably appear over the next few days. Wayland Games havent made the same announcement as Maelstrom yet because they have decided to spend a few days going over the terms. Heres what they posted on facebook:

Guys and girls, we are not ignoring you by not making a formal response to GW’s trade terms changes that were released today. We need some time to properly study them, as do the lawyers. So please bear with us until tomorrow when we will be able to elaborate.

Wayland Games
Maybe they will find some kind of loophole or something.

aka_mythos:

Maybe they will find some kind of loophole or something.

Pyro Stick
If they do, GW can simply ammend their terms of sales the next time Wayland or Maelestrom place an order.

snowblizz:

I for one would be happy to act as a conduit.
Although will the shipping site still work if you are on an non-uk isp?
not to sure on the workings of using a site from another country, but I recall someone mentioning you can block some countries from it.

But in that case I guess you could get someone to order it for you in the uk, receive it, then re-post it.

nitroglysarine
It better work, because there's a whole EU of IPs that need to be able to access it. Don't forget this isn't limited to the UK only.

You can block countries, of a fashion. In that you block all IPs that are assigned to that country. But that's waaaay beyond what anyone could expect a on-line retailer to do. In the capacity of limiting some items to be bought from certain countries. Not impossible, but it'll be a real hassle. And I'm sure that's why GW's trying to have it done.
Hmm... Just had an idea.

If you could redirect the IP someone in australia say could order through maelstrom but have only the invoice posted to a UK address (as opposed to having the payment from the UK).  The invoice would be in a different name though to the person who paid for it.  Would look quite fishy though.

Grimstonefire
It's not like they"post" an invoice though. They check the cardholder info with a bank and send it to where you ask (assuming creditcard that is). All my stuff is bought with a different address eg. Though of course the name is the same in my case. Just put it:
Your Name
c/o Guy Sent to
Guy's Address

You're visiting in another country, how are they to say anything?

I have in fact done this with TheWarstore. I bought some stuff and had it sent to a friend in the US because I was coming over for a visit.
The trick is to just have anyone who isn't obliged to follow GW's terms of sale sell you the miniatures. It can be nearly any retailer not buying directly from GW.

aka_mythos
Why would Maelstrom need to comply? Or in other words how is GW going to check what they do?

Besides how am I not allowed to buy a present for a friend that happens to live somewhere else?

The sheer stupidity of this boggles my mind really. But this is what I've come to expect from GW. They really should get it through their heads they aren't selling Ferraris but toysoldiers. Trying to limit how and when people buy the stuff won't increase their profits.

G.2:

This reminds me of the Coke vs Snapple incident that happened in Melbourne (and probably Australia wide) about 15 years ago. It happend something like this:

Snapple was being introduced into Australia, and certain shops/stores started stocking the product in their fridges alongside all the other cold beverages. This was really good for us Aussies, as Snapple was awesome. Then within about 3-4 months, the snapple started disappearing from the shops/stores…WTF?

Well somehow the Coca Cola company had some sort of issue (insert rumours here) with the Snapple product, and basically told the shop owners that anyone who had Snapple in their fridges, would not supplied with Coke. Which I am guessing is their #1 seller. So the shop owners agreed, that they would rather sell Coke than Snapple. Now 15 years later, you can NOT buy Snapple from anywhere in Australia.

aka_mythos:

The trick is to just have anyone who isn't obliged to follow GW's terms of sale sell you the miniatures. It can be nearly any retailer not buying directly from GW.

aka_mythos
Why would Maelstrom need to comply? Or in other words how is GW going to check what they do?

snowblizz
When GW sells directly to Maelstrom its not as simple as when they sell directly to you or me. Maelstrom is a retailer and wholesaler; GW makes them sign what is effectively the "Terms of Sales"... this is a fancy way of saying a contract you can't negotiate. These contractual obligations Maelstrom or any other retailer excepts is in exchange for getting GW's products at 45% off of their retail value. If they don't accept it, GW charges them near full or full retail price. They'd be, at best, regarded by GW as only a retailer and not wholeseller and thus, with specific exceptions, they couldn't sell to other retailer only to consumers.

wallacer:

Certainly goes to show how insignificant us Southern Hemisphere folk are in GW’s big picture.

On the bright side, those WF CD figures don’t seem quite as expensive as they used to.

nitroglysarine:

This reminds me of the Coke vs Snapple incident that happened in Melbourne (and probably Australia wide) about 15 years ago. It happend something like this:

Snapple was being introduced into Australia, and certain shops/stores started stocking the product in their fridges alongside all the other cold beverages. This was really good for us Aussies, as Snapple was awesome. Then within about 3-4 months, the snapple started disappearing from the shops/stores......WTF?
Well somehow the Coca Cola company had some sort of issue (insert rumours here) with the Snapple product, and basically told the shop owners that anyone who had Snapple in their fridges, would not supplied with Coke. Which I am guessing is their #1 seller. So the shop owners agreed, that they would rather sell Coke than Snapple. Now 15 years later, you can NOT buy Snapple from anywhere in Australia.

G.2
A similar thing happened with Red Bull in an off licence I worked in. There was a competive brand introduced in the fridges. Coca-cola owned the fridge rights (exclusivity right) so said we could only stock it out of the fridge. That year was the hottest on record in the uk (think its was 2004) So red bull sold at £1.50 a can as it was cold. The cheep alternative wouldn't sell at 49p as it was warm.
Even when the gap in the fridge was empty when they sold out, we were told by the regional management that we weren't allowed to fill the gap with the alternative.
It unfortunately the power that the big brands have, they can muscle the others out.

aka_mythos:

Thats part of Cokes terms of sale… those stores get their coke products at a cheaper price for following those rules. Often times enough Coke actually pays for some portion of the fridges their product goes in, for the retailer.

nitroglysarine:

Yeah they rent a shelf if I recall.

Still felt stupid, and I had to explain to customer after customer.

snowblizz:

When GW sells directly to Maelstrom its not as simple as when they sell directly to you or me. Maelstrom is a retailer and wholesaler; GW makes them sign what is effectively the "Terms of Sales"... this is a fancy way of saying a contract you can't negotiate. These contractual obligations Maelstrom or any other retailer excepts is in exchange for getting GW's products at 45% off of their retail value. If they don't accept it, GW charges them near full or full retail price. They'd be, at best, regarded by GW as only a retailer and not wholeseller and thus, with specific exceptions, they couldn't sell to other retailer only to consumers.

aka_mythos
I'm not confused as with the principle of the thing. I understand how it works. And also the limitations of trying to implement the measure.

GW is asking Maelstrom to comply with this and in so doing cut their own sale/profits, but there is no way GW can really check that the letter of the terms are adhered to.

aka_mythos:

If GW sees enough people posting on a forum that they purchased from Maelstrom, yet live in Australia… GW could request to see their sales records. Another way GW could determine if someone is selling outside their “zone” is if someone has a defective product and request from GW a replacement; GW will often enough ask for a lot number… depending on how good their records are they can see who they originally sold those kits too; if enough come up as going through Maelstrom, GW could choose to cut them off. If Maelstrom refused to cooperate with GW, GW could take them to court to try and see their records or just unilaterally decide not to do further business with Maelstrom.

All this proof seeking is if GW’s being nice. GW has no obligation to do business with anyone. Even if they only have a suspicion they can choose not to further sell to Maelstrom.

nitroglysarine:

It could be one of those, “officially we have been told to do this so we must look like we are doing so.” While at the same time actually changing nothing.

I guess there is one way GW could check if they are cooperating, try and do an international order for themselves from Maelstrom and see if it goes through or is stopped.

Necrotique:

Can’t remember which supplier it was, but I remember this happening a while back with a company that sold cheap games. The big-hat company wanted to sell all the units for maximum yield and so told the independent retailers they could not sell them to people anymore. In return, the company ended up selling the games as a “gift” and claimed that the many customers were just “friends lending them money.” :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

Was a much smaller scale and can’t remember the specifics, but it sprung to mind when I read this thread.

Edit: I think the company ended up selling them for the big-hats price but refunding the extra to make it back to the original price for the consumer.

:cheers