I was reading the Bugman’s Brewery topic related to 9th rules. I personally decided to play with KoW rules, but I’m still curious and not completely reluctant to the rest.
I’m a dwarf lover, evil or good, and the feeling I had while reading each post was that they are in the same situation than Chaos Dwarf players when GW decided to stop supporting our rules. The community arise, defending his army, writers wrote new rules, sculptors made their own minis and players used both of them, keeping this army alive.
And Forgeworld came and made an official rule pack and minis. It had some positive effects, like giving a legitimacy to the army in tournaments, and some negative, like bringing down the conversion level (no need to do some guards as they exist, no need to create new war machines as they’re not legal, etc).
Actually, every community is trying to imagine their future and their next rules. People supporting 9th try to balance their army, KoW players try the rules and gather a new community around them…
My main concern (I’m finally writing it :)), is that I don’t understand why we didn’t speak up to be part of this, trying to be a regular army in 9th ?
In KoW, Chaos Dwarfs are represented, but if 9th become the new fantasy standard, there is a superb opportunity to be part of it.
I’m not confident enough with English to imply in this, but we have a lot of good players which are.
By “9th Edition” are you referring to one of the fan-written rulesets derived from 8th Edition? Because otherwise you seem to be ignoring the actual current Warhammer game.
The biggest problem is what ninth edition? Unless I’m mistaken there are numerous ‘ninth’ edition projects out there and each is independent of the others. Unless the entire community can pull together and write a unified rule set, ultimately jumping on board any one of them will be futile as it’ll only be accepted by those who play that rule set. While there’s nothing wrong with having a fan made ruleset that not everyone follows, it’s hardly going to be the case that jumping on board one will make Chaos Dwarfs a major player in ninth edition (mostly because, as stated there won’t be a single unified ‘ninth’ edition, so at best they’ll only be a power in one of those).
It’s derived from the 8th, and made by people behind the ETC rules. They are the major community alternative to actual rules.
The topic on Warhammer.org.uk “only” have 30 answers, only enumerating actual units (giving good feedback), but absolutely not imaginative for anything new.
It is weird to be fiddling with army lists when the main rules aren’t solidified yet. Like trying to hit a moving target.
I can’t understand why they want to change so much of the main rules in the first place. Tidy up the bits that don’t work and leave everything else alone.
My 3rd edition / Ewal Dvergar / Berderken / Scotia Grendel army (which is nearly finished) will be taken for Warhammer 8th Edition and probably KoW games.
The Titan Wargames Miniatures will become a AoS warband, I will need 1 or 2 warmachines and some BC conversions …
For Mortheim I builded a warband some years ago.
So I have enough to do to build up the AoS warband. If this task is finished I will see what I can do …
Game system discussions aside, the main difficulty that the community faces now is the fact that the one thing that anchored “Chaos Dwarfs” to the current setting - their indisputable presence in the Warhammer world - is now moot, since the planet itself has been destroyed. No one quite knows what will be lurking in the Mortal Realms, but given the background changes that have been made to existing ranges so far, it’s extremely unlikely they’ll exist in any form recognisable to us.
So, there are a couple of choices, as I see it: continue, like many, to play in “the world-that-was”, with AoS/8th/9th/KoW/whatever and develop the story of Warhammer from where the End Times left off, either with an alternate conclusion (perhaps Manfred didn’t sell out literally everyone because of his petty rivalries…), or in the vaguely-defined time when Chaos enveloped everything and time flowed in odd ways. Some civilisations might have survived for subjective centuries, and Chaos Dwarfs could easily be one of them. If anyone can hold back a tide of daemons pouring into reality, it’s them.
The other option is to transplant your vision of Chaos Dwarfs into the Age of Sigmar, either as survivors who managed to create an enclave in the Realm of Chaos and last out the aeons, or a brand new renegade duardin faction, warped during the Age of Chaos. How about savage, cannibalistic Chaos Dwarfs in the style of the Khorne Bloodbound? Or duardin of Aqshy or Chamon who have survived under their new overlords by becoming the Blacksmiths of Chaos? Hashut may have endured and become attracted to this new generation of Dawi’Zharr, setting up a cult that resembles the one that existed in the World Before Time. Ziggurats rise across some blasted region of the Mortal Realms, and slaving bands a million strong scour the wastes…
The problem, as with the attempts to create a 9th Edition, is getting enough people on the same page to make a “community” out of one or more of these ideas. I guess it will live or die on how popular Age of Sigmar proves to be. I personally think it’s an exciting time, but I’m aware not everyone is going to be willing or able to find their niche in such an open, currently ill-defined setting.
Game system discussions aside, the main difficulty that the community faces now is the fact that the one thing that anchored "Chaos Dwarfs" to the current setting - their indisputable presence in the Warhammer world - is now moot, since the planet itself has been destroyed. No one quite knows what will be lurking in the Mortal Realms, but given the background changes that have been made to existing ranges so far, it's extremely unlikely they'll exist in any form recognisable to us.
So, there are a couple of choices, as I see it: continue, like many, to play in "the world-that-was", with AoS/8th/9th/KoW/whatever and develop the story of Warhammer from where the End Times left off, either with an alternate conclusion (perhaps Manfred didn't sell out literally everyone because of his petty rivalries...), or in the vaguely-defined time when Chaos enveloped everything and time flowed in odd ways. Some civilisations might have survived for subjective centuries, and Chaos Dwarfs could easily be one of them. If anyone can hold back a tide of daemons pouring into reality, it's them.
The other option is to transplant your vision of Chaos Dwarfs into the Age of Sigmar, either as survivors who managed to create an enclave in the Realm of Chaos and last out the aeons, or a brand new renegade duardin faction, warped during the Age of Chaos. How about savage, cannibalistic Chaos Dwarfs in the style of the Khorne Bloodbound? Or duardin of Aqshy or Chamon who have survived under their new overlords by becoming the Blacksmiths of Chaos? Hashut may have endured and become attracted to this new generation of Dawi'Zharr, setting up a cult that resembles the one that existed in the World Before Time. Ziggurats rise across some blasted region of the Mortal Realms, and slaving bands a million strong scour the wastes...
The problem, as with the attempts to create a 9th Edition, is getting enough people on the same page to make a "community" out of one or more of these ideas. I guess it will live or die on how popular Age of Sigmar proves to be. I personally think it's an exciting time, but I'm aware not everyone is going to be willing or able to find their niche in such an open, currently ill-defined setting.
Thommy H
brilliant
the power of imagination
personally my chaos dwarf force survived through multiple alliances with chaos daemons, selling their technology for survival
they are now powerfull enough to be considered as a single army
but they are more tainted than ever , almost renegades like their distant ancesters from a far far away era
I haven’t played WHFB in years, so I’m not as invested in this aspect of the hobby as others are. I play different mini wargames and my love of Chaos Dwarfs is purely a retro kick and a fondness for their fluff. That being said, I would love to see them carried over into AoS. Given that Hashut protected the Chaos Dwarfs during the first Storm of Chaos, it doesn’t make sense for him to allow his only followers (and believers) to be annihilated at the End Times. I imagine Hashut would somehow shield the Dawi Zharr and magic them over to the realm of Chaos.
Rules: I only play with friends, so we play 8th edition uncomped, with extra houserules (Black Orcs + Spear Chukkahs for me fx) and a ton of homemade specialcharacters for the lulz. 9th age seems cool, but I will let the pros decide these things, and probably never read it or play it.
Motivation: The End Times hit me hard, or rather, the time between Archaon and Age of Sigmar hit me hard. I was reading all the rumours and fearing for me beloved Warhammer fantasy. When Sigmar hit, and WFB was officially fisted in the backdoor, I was first frightened, but then I realised that all the bad decions wouldn’t hit me or my gaming group. New models wont be released, but thats not a problem for the next 15 years on my part. It actually oppened a lot of cool things, both narative and gamewise. My group has decided that every army most have acces to cool Battlescrolls like the elves have in Archaon, which allows new units and so forth.
That’s given me an idea actually. They’ve yet to release something new for AoS that fits fluffwise in 8th ed.
I.e. Chaos side isn’t really new, chaos lord/ marauders/ warriors/ spawn.
sigmar side has no place fluffwise in 8th.
But if they do are people planning to do storm of magic type scrolls to revert them back?
If tourney organisers were to make a ruling organisers and release SoM scrolls themselves it would all fit in whilst still allowing people to use models, as long as ranked on square I guess.
I’ve jumped to KoW. I’ll be building my future Chaos Dwarfs into Abyssal Dwarfs. Using as much fluff and background from the new game as I can. Warhammer is dead to me. My Greater Obsidian Golem is a bit overkill model-wise for its in-game stats now, but c’est la vie.
It took the death of Warhammer to make me realize, but I actually have hated almost everything that Games Workshop has done since the 1990’s. Their business model, their pricing structure, their rules, their rules support, their community engagement, their shitty CAD miniatures, their general ‘World of Warcraft’ design aesthetic was all the opposite of what I want to support. It turns out I’d been playing a game that hadn’t existed for almost two decades, except in my own mind. But I kept playing because of all the fun that I remembered.
They are a bad company with bad products and they have a complete disregard, or even outright contempt, for their customers. Selling people hundreds of dollars of End Times books and then immediately making them obsolete and useless should have made that clear to everyone.
As such I won’t even give GW the tacit endorsement of playing any fan or community derivative of their games. I’m not going to burn my models, but I’m not going to play Warhammer 9th or the 9th age, or 8.5 or any other such thing. I’m going to put my support and my $$ behind Mantic. That is partially because in relation to everything I listed about GW above, they are the opposite, and partially because it’s a really good game.
I’m always sad to hear about a player who moves to another system but, at least in this case, I totally understand why. I’m sure I’m not the only person who will miss ya around here! Best of luck with KoW!! :cheers
This is still a Chaos Dwarf site, even if you don’t use that army to play a GW game. Everyone is welcome to stay and talk about using their evil dwarf models in other game systems.
This is still a Chaos Dwarf site, even if you don't use that army to play a GW game. Everyone is welcome to stay and talk about using their evil dwarf models in other game systems.
cornixt
Here! Here! That is exactly what it is, or should become
Sorry, I assumed you’d feel the pull of a Kings of War site since I don’t think I have ever seen a KoW post here before. I hope you and anyone else who feels GWs knife in their back as sharply as you and I do will stay and contribute. Plenty of folks have thrown their hands in the air and walked away - I must be starting to see it happen everywhere.
