[TOW] Chaos Dwarfs, not Legion of ... Something

Chaos Dwarf Discussion Army List and Gaming Discussion
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Grew up building O&G army but fall in love with 1994 CDs… Which were very hard to get and expensive so never really had a chance to build them. I have built an Abyssal Dwarfs army years later with some CD models (rocket launchers, Lamassu and Great Taurus minis).

Now tOW restored Chaos Dwarfs (not Legion of Azgorh) and I finally got a chance to build a small army (CD are so expensive in points). Luckly I got some Bull Centaur Renders few years ago to use ad Grotesques and had some Mantic Blacksouls infantry left from my Abyssal Dwarfs to build blunderbussiers (I really enjoy those new plastics) with too .With fire elementals STL from Mantic I have enough to enjoy new CD.

Here are my first 2 lists. 1500 and 2000 I hope You could comment on.

===
Chaos Dwarfs, elite, 1500 [1502 pts]
Warhammer: The Old World, Chaos Dwarfs

++ Characters [490 pts] ++

Daemonsmith Sorcerer [255 pts]

  • Darkforged weapon
  • Heavy armour
  • Be a Level 2 Wizard
  • Great Taurus
  • Enchanted Shield
  • Daemonology

Daemonsmith Sorcerer [235 pts]

  • Darkforged weapon
  • Heavy armour
  • Level 2 Wizard
  • Lammasu Sorcerous Exhalation
  • Daemonology

++ Core Units [384 pts] ++

12 Infernal Guard [192 pts]

  • Hailshot blunderbluss
  • Heavy armour

12 Infernal Guard [192 pts]

  • Hailshot blunderbluss
  • Heavy armour

++ Special Units [628 pts] ++

3 K’daai Fireborn [130 pts]

  • Hand weapons
  • Manburner (champion)

3 Bull Centaur Renders [189 pts]

  • Hand weapons
  • Light armour
  • Shield
  • Ba’hal
  • Standard bearer

3 Bull Centaur Renders [189 pts]

  • Hand weapons
  • Light armour
  • Shield
  • Ba’hal
  • Standard bearer

1 Deathshrieker Rocket Launcher [120 pts]

  • Demolition Rockets
  • Infernal Incendiaries
  • Hand weapons
  • Heavy armour

AND

===
Copy of Chaos Dwarfs, elite [1998 pts]
Warhammer: The Old World, Chaos Dwarfs

++ Characters [665 pts] ++

Sorcerer-Prophet [425 pts]

  • Darkforged weapon
  • Heavy armour
  • Level 4 Wizard
  • General
  • Bale Taurus
  • Mantle of Stone
  • Daemonology

Daemonsmith Sorcerer [240 pts]

  • Darkforged weapon
  • Heavy armour
  • Level 2 Wizard
  • Lammasu Sorcerous Exhalation
  • Earthing Rod
  • Daemonology

++ Core Units [594 pts] ++

12 Infernal Guard [210 pts]

  • Fireglaives
  • Heavy armour
  • Shield
  • Deathmask
  • Standard bearer
  • Musician

12 Infernal Guard [192 pts]

  • Hailshot blunderbluss
  • Heavy armour

12 Infernal Guard [192 pts]

  • Hailshot blunderbluss
  • Heavy armour

++ Special Units [739 pts] ++

3 K’daai Fireborn [130 pts]

  • Hand weapons
  • Manburner (champion)

3 Bull Centaur Renders [189 pts]

  • Hand weapons
  • Light armour
  • Shield
  • Ba’hal
  • Standard bearer

1 Deathshrieker Rocket Launcher [120 pts]

  • Demolition Rockets
  • Infernal Incendiaries
  • Hand weapons
  • Heavy armour

1 Deathshrieker Rocket Launcher [120 pts]

  • Demolition Rockets
  • Infernal Incendiaries
  • Hand weapons
  • Heavy armour

1 Hobgoblin Bolt Thrower [45 pts]

  • Bolt thrower
  • Hand weapons
  • Light armour

1 Hobgoblin Bolt Thrower [45 pts]

  • Bolt thrower
  • Hand weapons
  • Light armour

1 Hobgoblin Bolt Thrower [45 pts]

  • Bolt thrower
  • Hand weapons
  • Light armour

1 Hobgoblin Bolt Thrower [45 pts]

  • Bolt thrower
  • Hand weapons
  • Light armour

Created with “Old World Builder”

[https://old-world-builder.com]

1 Like
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Cheers mate, well met!

First a technicality: Daemonsmith Sorcerers and Sorcerer-Prophets cannot be equipped with a magic shield.

We’re always constrained by the models we have, but especially when looking at the 1500pts army, I’d be concerned with the low model count. Lose 3 Blunderbusses and you have to take a panic test. LD9 is good, but far from immune to psychology. Additionally, the hardest hitters in the army are the Fireborn and the monsters with S5, the rest only makes S4 attacks in close combat, all without any AP. Very numerous armies will swarm and drag you down, while armies with high toughness and good armour will probably whether your attacks beat you in combat.
At least for the 1500pts army I would only go with one monster and get some more models on the ground. Infernal Guard with Shields are way cheaper than Blunderbusses but more durable, Great Weapons get S6 and some AP. Hobgoblins are dirt cheap and give you much more models. Either one of those three units would be good.

3 Likes
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I will consider Hobgoblins when I get models I like but they are very classic option to have!

I know numbers are an issue but those are models I already have in-progress… But that being said I was thinking about replacing one Bull centaur unit with cheaper infantry to use the detachment rules! 20+10BB+10BB.

No shield - ok. Thanks. So I can take only those item types I can normally have?

Also - I think that 5x4 is not perfect for infantry right now so what would You think about a 6x3 regiment size?

2 Likes
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Yes, I think that might be a good way to go. Bull Centaurs are OK, nice on the charge actually, but then only have two attacks at S4. Plus they lost a whooping 2 points in armour save compared to last edition which really hurts them. A unit of infantry might be better.

Yes, any model can only have magic armour items if they can have the mundane version of it. Plus things like helmets, cause there is no mundany equivalent.

Depends on the unit and what you want to do with it! Chaos Dwarfs have low initiative, so chances are high your opponent attacks first. For an anvil unit, a 5x4 formation is still good for static combat res. Lose 5 models and you have CR4 (close order, 2 ranks, standard). In a 6x3 formation, loosing 5 models means you have CR3 with only a chance of getting to CR4 if that lone surviving Chaos Dwarf actually kills something.

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5

I did watch a BR on a Mountain Miniatures YT channel and there was a list with smaller 12ish dwarf glaive units + some K’dai and engines. And it did very well. There were flame throwers instead of balista but in general it did very well. Sure I might hit a infantry spam list but CD has some serious shooting short and long range and balista seems to be a great option to hunt those crazy monsters.

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Oh, absolutely, I didn’t want to give the impression that this list would get tabled left and right.

7

I think this is also a selling point for me. Small number of minis to paint. I could be adding more later.

More expensive war machines, infantry blocks etc.

2 Likes
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I highly recommend the Fabelzel hobgoblins for use in armies with the 4th/5th chorf aesthetic :kissing_smiling_eyes::ok_hand: They paint up like a dream, it seriously takes 5 minutes per model :zap: They can also easily stand side by side with the GW ones without it looking weird

2 Likes
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Thanks. Are they available in STLs? I am not really looking to replicate 1994 vibes but I do have enough old models to give a theme. On the other hand I use Mantic plastic blacksouls so what is key to keep a coherent basing and painting scheme. I try to avoid newer model designs which are “more and better” and overloaded with detail.

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If you’re speaking of the game where he played the entire army of T3 no armor save ground pounding Witch Elves… Yeah, he did awesome lol. I think Chorf gunline just autowins that matchup. Especially when you’re taking things like Dreadquakes. Those poor elves never stood a chance.

Despite all but inherently busted lists army composition will always have glaring weaknesses. Whether that’s being outnumbered in every game, having lots of attacks of low str, high str but low volume of attacks, magic dense but melee light, melee heavy but magic light…etc etc ad infinitum. So disirregardless of what you craft you’re playing an opponent but you’re also playing against all those gaps and failures of “the perfect build”.

I consider this to be invaluable. My own force is extremely focused on Psychology and hopefully with any luck NOT fighting… because I don’t have the # of troops to sustain a prolonged brutal confrontation… because I’ve dedicated soooo many points to the Pscyh game. You see my dilemma lol? Beyond the conceived view of what an unknown meta is going to look like it was pointed out and I was also aware that, it’s hot trash against Immune to Psych armies. Namely undead factions being that they’re so popular. There’s no way around this obvious flaw in my entire overall battleplan. Someone fields Tomb Kings with Ambushers and we skip deployment and I shake their hands “Good game!”.

As the game size grows that particular weakness becomes more and more evident. The only solution is too gambit that entire game on destroying their General as fast as possible. “All in” you might say. Literally commit EVERY resource to making that a reality as soon as possible. So instead of the 3rd Sorc I WANT to run I have to shoehorn in a Black Orc on Wyvern, tool him up and take him to beat street with a Sorc on Bale T backing him up, turn 1. Hope for the best and roll that beautiful bean footage.

Or accept on incoming 95/5 loss probability. So I’m not really planning on any particular ItP faction, I’m planning on rectifying that confrontation with the most aggressive middle linebacker I can put on a wyvern.

Play to your strengths, know your own weaknesses better than your opponent, adapt tactics based on matchup, don’t be afraid to risk everything in your potential worst matchups. You were in trouble before you even fielded your models. Aggressive adaptive strategy can and will confuse your opponent who might’ve thought they had this game on a lock.

Good luck friend!

11

I am aware that tOW is not a Kings of War where You can deal with a lot with a lot of builds.

I already notices that 1500-2000 list is very limited in options in general. Not enough to get all the tools in a toolbox. 50% of the army can be heroes. This gives us an idea of how weird lists can be. 500+ dragon or a flood of Night Goblins. Builds are very meta dependent. And not very balanced is some matchups.

There’s no way around this obvious flaw in my entire overall battle plan. Someone fields Tomb Kings with Ambushers and we skip deployment and I shake their hands “Good game!”.

Brutal.

Psychology control? Tell me more!

Yeah - wyvern with Black Orc warlord :smiley: I in general want to try my favourite units first. And I am aware there are some drawbacks build into even the best dwarfs. Chaos ones. :wink:

That being said there are things we can do to a list to make it better. That is why I asked about mine lists. Maby some tweaks, different items etc.

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Couldn’t agree more, which is why I love the old school style sculpts. I believe the hobgoblins are old enough to be available for free on thingiverse. They’d be called eastern goblins.

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Not original scuplts but very good sculpts inspired by those classics.

You can also find balista and earthshakers;’ replica here (no crew):

And this is for those who like Forge World esthetics or want K’daii models (they are too fancy for my taste so went for Mantic Fire Elements and they fits great).
https://cults3d.com/en/users/MeshyMesh/3d-models

2 Likes
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I believe I managed to grab some of the Oldhammer 3D scanned files off a seller on Cults3D, before he unlisted everything… he had a full collection of Chaos Dwarf warrior, blunderbuss, Hobogoblin warriors, archers, and sneaky gits on there. There were also all the lord & hero choses as well as the general on taurus mini – also Astrogath.

Sadly I prioritized the Mordheim models – it wasn’t that expensive and I should have just bought all of them, but alas hindsight is 20/20…

Perhaps, not all is lost, as he did unlist everything this feburary and everything came back, for a while…
Conversations with madinvinh • 103 comments • Discussion thread about 3D printing, 3D modeling, laser cutting, CNC machining or papercraft・Cults (cults3d.com)

1 Like
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Ok.

My 1-1.4k list is almost painted. I need last 5 dwarfs to get my CORE done. War Machines/heores are painted and Bull Centaurs are WIP.

CD3
CD32000×1500 205 KB

CD2
CD22000×1500 174 KB

cd
cd2000×1500 189 KB

4
41500×2000 131 KB

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The lava effects here are next level. That bolt thrower is about to burst into flame!

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Wow those abyssal dwarves look amazing! Best ive ever seen them. The lava effects are so good!

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Yes! I know it is about to burst into flame but hobgoblins were told to position in range to the enemy and so they did.

I am super glad You like it! I did those in a TT+ standard with a mix of speed paints and layering to cut some corners and decided to focus on lava effect. Bases are the most important thing!

Here is my re-based Taurus with a new, bigger base. And the same model on an older one.

GT
GT640×3249 883 KB

IMG_20240317_115627
IMG_20240317_1156271920×2560 332 KB

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New plastic Abyssal Dwarfs are great for mass battle games. Easy to build, simple enough to do the fast and detailed enough to have fun. I really like my HEX BSB too :smiley:

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I think I will add an Iron Daemon next. A very potent piece in the army.

I really dislike FW steampunk weapons so was thinking this…

reward-month-6
reward-month-61920×1080 99.8 KB

KoW-Abyssal-Dwarf-Hellfane-colour-shot_WEB
KoW-Abyssal-Dwarf-Hellfane-colour-shot_WEB1000×1000 187 KB

5 Likes