[Archive] Bloodbeards Blooded Horde [06-03-15: 2400p Hobgoblin Legion! - Time for debate]

Archive [Archive] Army Lists
1

Bloodbeard:

So I’ll soon be playing my first game of warhammer in years, and I’ll use my newly made CDs in a campaign. The campaign will only be with 1000 point armies, use the rules from Mighty Empires and it’s called Schädel island. So I’ll post my 1000 point armylist here. I have 2 castellans in reserve, but otherwise a havn’t made more minis than the included.

But what i would really like is some advice for what should be added next. Next thing I’m building is bullcentaurs, because I like the minis. I would like to expand in ca 500 point blocks.

1000 point army

Heroes

Daemonpriest Sorcerer

Lvl 2

Luckstone, dragonhelmet (+1 armorsave)

145

Daemonpriest Sorcerer

Enchanted shield

100

Core

Infernal Guard w. fire glaives

Full command

372

Special

Infernal Ironsworn

Full command

Banner of Swiftness (+1 movement)

377

In all: 997

Thoughts, questions, tips needed:

1. Should I include regular infernal guard instead of ironsworn? Would give me some points for other banners. Are ironsworn worth the points?

2. K’daii Destroyer- Heard that he’s a gamewinner and a must have. Is this true? And in what game size?

3. Warmachines? By reading the rules I can’t really decide which warmachines to build (all my miniatures will by build from scrap and bits).

What machines should I go for? Dreadquake Mortar, Iron Demon, Skullcracker, Magna Canon, Deathshrieker or Hellcanon (from WoC). They are all going to be cool miniatures, but it’s smart to prioreties. And should a make them with steam carriages?

4. Hobgoblins. They are cheap, they are usefull. I don’t like them, and properbly won’t include them - even if it costs me all victories.

5. I’m working on a lord for a mount. Should I build a bale taurus og a lammasu for him?

Thanks for your help.

2

ClawLeader:

I started with a death rocket. Versatile, and not hard to make. Either from there go with a magma cannon or iron demon

3

Bloodbeard:

Used the following list for my first game fighting with Chaos Dwarfs - and only my second game of 8th ED. I won!

Wrote the special rules and stats on my army list, so i wouldn’t forget everything and would have to look in the books all the time.

Heroes:

Daemonsmith

3/4/4/4/4/2/2/2/9

Dragonhelm (2++ mod Fire), Luck stone, Enscorled HW (+1S), Naptha Bomb

110p

Castellan

3/6/4/4/5/2/3/3/9

BSB, Enchanted shield

135p

Core:

Infernalguard, 20             

3/4/3/4/4/1/2/1/9

Full Command, HW, Shield

War Banner +1 CR

307p

Infernalguard, 11      

Full Command, Fireglaive, Shield

Fireglaive: S4, R18�?T�?T, Armor Piercing

202p

Rare:

Hellcannon                             

3/4/3/5/6/5/1/5/4 4+,5++

12-60�?T�?T, s5(s10,d6w)

Caged Fury: LD ellers 3D6�?T�?T

Panic test ved cas

Large taget, terror, unbreakable,  daemonic attacks

210p

In all 996

Special Rules:

Resolute: Pursue/flee 2d6-1

Blackshard Armour: 4+, 5++ mod fire

Infernal Engineer: 3�?T�?T re-roll scatter/artillery

Sorcerer Curse: Ved miscast T-test. -1W +1T

Naptha Bomb: D3, S3 hits, throwing w, flaming, armour piercing

4

Bloodbeard:

So a couple of friends and I are gonna play a game before going celebrating christmas with our families.

I hate playing with stand ins or proxies. I’m not done painting everything i have, so I can’t really start build new miniatures before the battle.

So this list actually has everything I have in it. But I can field countless goblins if that would be better, and a do have acces to more hero miniatures.

The game will be 1500 point multiplayer Triumph and Treachery. I haven’t tried it yet. I’m going up against High Elves and Vampire Counts. Perhaps some dwarfs or WoC will join in.

Here’s the list. CC would be nice. I’ll start expanding the army soon and could do so with following projects: GW IG, blunderbusses, 4 BCs and 1 Taur’uk, 3 K’daii, lord on bale, deathshrieker, iron demon, 2 magmacannon.¨

1500 points

+ Lords + (360pts)

    * Sorceror Prophet (360pts)

        (Contempt, Daemonsmith, Immune to psychology, Infernal Engineer, Relentless, Resolute, Sorcerer’s Curse)

        Chalice of Blood and Darkness (50pts), Enchanted Shield (5pts), Level 4 (35pts), Lore of Hashut, Luckstone (5pts)

+ Heroes + (205pts)

    * Infernal Castellan (205pts)

        (Contempt, Relentless, Resolute, Stubborn)

        Battle Standard Bearer (25pts), Great Weapon (5pts), Ironcurse Icon (5pts), Mask of the Furnace (65pts)

+ Core + (725pts)

    * Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (382pts)

        (Contempt, Relentless, Resolute)

        Deathmask (12pts), Musician (10pts)

        * 20x Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (340pts)

            20x Fireglave (100pts)

        * Standard Bearer (20pts)

            Banner of Eternal Flame (10pts)

    * Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (343pts)

        (Contempt, Relentless, Resolute)

        23x Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (276pts), Deathmask (12pts), Musician (10pts)

        * Standard Bearer (45pts)

            War Banner (35pts)

+ Rare + (210pts)

    * Hellcannon (210pts)

        (Bound Daemon, Contempt, Large Target, Monster, Rampage, Relentless, Resolute, Terror, Unbreakable)

Notes

Lord and hero go with 23 IG with HW/S. Warbanner + BSB gives them an extra 2 in combat resolution.

Hoping for ashstorm, so the fireglaives will be able to shoot big stuff to pieces or chop it up in close combat with flaming attacks.

5

Time of Madness:

At 1500pts it is a fairly weak list unfortunately. But, I understand your situation if you only have these models available.

The fireglaives work better in small supporting units of 10 or 12 strong. So you may want to consider breaking up the unit you have.

The prophet would be better off with just level 4, enchanted shield and talisman of preservation for the 2+ and then 4+ save. The bsb should drop the great weapon and take a shield again for the 2+ and 4+ saves. You need these characters to stay alive!

I dislike the warbanner, you’d be better off with the lichebone pennant for the 3+ ward save on your characters from death magic snipes.

If you had the points I’d look at taking 28 infernal guard with hand weapon shields. When the general/bsb join the unit it is now 30 strong.

This list really lacks some flank support. I realize you have the hellcannon on the flanks, but you’d be better off with a unit of k’daai/centaurs or even wolf riders to use on the flanks.

Hope this helps.

Time of Madness

6

Bloodbeard:

Thanks for the advice TOM. This will only be my 5th game with CD and 6th game in 8ed warhammer - so any advice is very welcome. Luckily I’ve won three games and played one draw. I’ll just ask some more questions to learn why you say as you do.

The prophet would be better of with just level 4, enchanted shield and talisman of preservation for the 2+ and then 4+ save.

Time of Madness
Why no Chalice? I’ll be going up against some serious magic, plus I’ll bring a lot with my lvl 4. Everybody hates this items because of its power. But is the wardsave worth more?
The fireglaives work better in small supporting units of 10 or 12 strong. So you may want to consider breaking up the unit you have.

Time of Madness
Would you still put a command groups in those small units? Reminds me of my time as an Empire general. I the previous games, I’ve had great succes with the fireglaives shooting a couple of rounds and them going into combat. That extra strength really hels with the killing. But i might be smarter with small units. Just for flank bonus and denying rank bonus’.
I dislike the warbanner, you’d be better off with the lichebone pennant for the 3+ ward save on your characters from death magic snipes.

Time of Madness
That’s a nice save. Plus the 6++ on the regular joes in the regiment will be great. The vampire counts player will have some kind of magic and i know the HE player is bringing a lore master. Will make this change.
You’d be better off with a unit of k’daai/centaurs or even wolf riders to use on the flanks.

Time of Madness
I have the minis to build three k’daii fireborn before the game, but after reading the rules (burning bright and unstable) I guess you really need six for them to work. I could also build up to 5 bull centaurs before the game - that’ll give me some speed on the flanks.

How many BCs should i field in a 1500 point game? And should I go with extra handweapons for the extra attack?
The Destroyer

Myself
I could use my big bale taurus as a k’daii destroyer. Should I do that? That would cost me my bull centaur option.

And if I bring the destroyer (or the perhaps til bull centaur) should I go hand weapon/shield, great weapon or fireglaive on my core choice. Remember one of my enemies will be a warriors of chaos army. So perhaps the GW strength would be good.

7

Abecedar:

Not much good at lists so i can’t really help there but I agree with “madness” you need some K’daii or BC’s for the flanks and their speed.

Why don’t you like Hobgoblins?

8

Bloodbeard:

Not much good at lists so i can't really help there but I agree with "madness" you need some K'daii or BC's for the flanks and their speed.

Why don't you like Hobgoblins?

Abecedar
Because I'm a chaos dwarf player and not a goblin player - but mostly I would hate to convert and paint 40 (minimum) goblins at only 200 points.

(and i havn't good just the right idea yet. When i get the idea I'll make the minis.)
9

Time of Madness:

The chalice is a good option, but I disagree with how it is played (personal opinion). People play it as the rules are written, but it was never intended to played that way. In 1500pt games I’d leave it at home.

Same with the destroyer, its a good way to lose friends taking one at 1500pts.

Fireglaives in my opinion work better in units of 10 or 12 with no command. If you have spare points and play scenarios, it might be worth adding the standard.

K’daai at 1500pts are probably not worth it. They tend to be better in large games in units of 6.

Squeeze a small unit of bull centaurs with great weapons/shields in if you can. It will give you a nice flanking unit.

Hope that helps.

Time of Madness

10

Bloodbeard:

Thank’s for the advice. But actually people play the chalice as it is written - and as intended. Check these answers from forge world: Redirecting...

11

Time of Madness:

Thanks for that link. It’s funny how opinions change over time. When I submitted the FAQ a couple of years back the chalice question wasposed. They never answered it firmly, but FW made it clear it was never intended to be played that way. Looks like they changed their stance on the issue back in 2012.

Now wonder you see the chalice “banned” in most tournies!

Time of Madness

12

Bloodbeard:

1500 point - listened to advice

So I listened to some of Time of Madness’ advice and came up with another list for the games I just played. I proxied my destroyer using my bale taurus and quickly threw together some Bull Centaurs.

I used the list in 1 game and then changed it for several reason. My lord got eaten by a frozen phoenix lacking a ward save, and the fireglaives didn’t get to shoot and the BCs didn’t have room to maneuvre in the multiplayer game and thus died i turn 1.

Here’s the list (changed some things for game two, see that list in the next post)and read the battle report here:

+ Lords + (360pts)

* Sorceror Prophet (360pts)

(Contempt, Daemonsmith, Immune to psychology, Infernal Engineer, Relentless, Resolute, Sorcerer’s Curse)

Chalice of Blood and Darkness (50pts), Enchanted Shield (5pts), Level 4 (35pts), Lore of Hashut, Luckstone (5pts)

+ Heroes + (205pts)

* Infernal Castellan (205pts)

(Contempt, Relentless, Resolute, Stubborn)

Battle Standard Bearer (25pts), Great Weapon (5pts), Ironcurse Icon (5pts), Mask of the Furnace (65pts)

+ Core + (438pts)

* Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (438pts)

(Contempt, Relentless, Resolute)

Deathmask (12pts), Musician (10pts)

* 23x Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (391pts)

23x Fireglave (115pts)

* Standard Bearer (25pts)

Lichebone Pennant (15pts)

+ Special + (165pts)

* Bull Centaur Renders (165pts)

(Cause Fear, Contempt, Scaly Skin)

Bull Centaur Ba’hal (10pts), Musician (5pts)

* 3x Bull Centaur Renders (135pts)

3x Additional Hand Weapon (15pts)

* Standard Bearer (15pts)

Gleaming Pennant (5pts)

+ Rare + (325pts)

* K’daai Destroyer (325pts)

(Blazing Body, Bound Fire Daemon, Burning Bright, Flaming Attacks, Frenzy, Large Target, Terror, Unbreakable, Unstable)

13

Bloodbeard:

The 1500 points - all painted list

The High Elf Smasher!

Just played a game against a High Elf army. 1500 points. He fielded a completed painted army - so i decided to do the same.

That didn’t leave me a lot of options. So no WIP destroyer, no WIP BCs and no WIP fireborn.

But I would still like some respons on hero/lord tool-out, banners etc.

Check the battle report here:

The Plan

I expected a frost phoenix. So Ash Storm the bird - shoot him up with flaming fireglaives or fireballs. Hoping for double wounds. … turned out he brought a fire phoenix - so that sucked.

After that ashstorm his large infantry block and black hammer his heros in challenges.

A fine plan.

Lords (360pts)

Sorceror Prophet (360pts)

Chalice of Blood and Darkness (50pts), Lore of Hashut, Talisman of Preservation (45pts)

Heroes (300pts)

Daemonsmith Sorcerer (95pts)

Lore of Fire

Infernal Castellan (205pts)

Battle Standard Bearer (25pts), Black Hammer of Hashut (35pts), Enchanted Shield (5pts), Ironcurse Icon (5pts), Talisman of Endurance (30pts)

Core (629pts)

Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (383pts)

28x Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (336pts), Deathmask (12pts), Musician (10pts), standard Bearer (25pts), Lichebone Pennant (15pts)

Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (246pts)

Deathmask (12pts), Musician (10pts)

12x Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (204pts)

12x Fireglave (60pts)

Standard Bearer (20pts)

Banner of Eternal Flame (10pts)

Rare (210pts)



Hellcannon (210pts)

14

Bloodbeard:

This armylist is pretty much based on the models I have available. Instead of a large unit of fireborn, I would much rather field some warmachines. So once I’ve painted up all the k’daii - I must build some machines of death.

Used this list against two armies. I destroyed a Warriors of Chaos army completely - but against bretonians i scored a total of 0 victory points.

My prophet started out with becoming a lvl 1 loosing all but hellhammer. …[/u]

But the list worked out great against WoC. Read the battle report here:

questions:

[/u] An irondemon wouldn’t do much good against a unit of knight would it? Only damaging by thunderstomp i round 2 i can’t do anything? Or am I wrong?

[/u] If a lvl 1 daemonsmith loses his only lvl from miscast - do he loose the ability to use the chalice?

Lords(310pts)

Sorceror Prophet (310pts)

Level 4, Lore of Hashut, Luckstone, Pistol, Mask of the Furnace

Heroes(355pts)

* Daemonsmith Sorcerer (145pts)

Chalice of Blood and Darkness, Lore of Metal

* Infernal Castellan (210pts)

Battle Standard Bearer, Black Hammer of Hashut, Enchanted Shield , Ironcurse Icon , Pistol , Talisman of Endurance

Core(604pts)

* Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (219pts)

Deathmask (12pts), Musician (10pts), Standard Bearer (10pts)

* 11x Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (187pts)

11x Fireglave (55pts)

* Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (385pts)

28x Chaos Dwarf Infernal Guard (336pts), Musician (10pts)

* Deathmask (14pts)

Pistol (2pts)

* Standard Bearer (25pts)

Lichebone Pennant (15pts)

Special(340pts)

* K’daai Fireborn (340pts)

6x K’daai Fireborn (330pts), K’daai Manburner (10pts)

Rare(325pts)

* K’daai Destroyer (325pts)

15

Bloodbeard:

I used the above list in a game against bretonians. Check the tale of a crushing defeat here:

I would really like some tips, tricks or advice on how to beat those ponyboys. What would you do?

The enemy
A lvl 4 fairy godmother of life (doom) guarded by a host of grail knights, a nasty jean d’arc type (protected by the gods) with a unit of knights of the realm, a unit of knights errant with a bsb wielding bsb, a horde of 50 men at arms with a lvl 1 beast sorceress. And a pretty big trebuchet.

Problems - I see
- speed. They pray, they wait, they get a lot of charges in.
- ward saves. If we go higher strength, they get higher ward saves.
- grail knight. Magic attacks all around. Kills destroyer fast.

Things i could do
- Get a khan to eat the trebuchet. And redirect.

16

TheFNG:

Check my reply to your Batrep.  :)

17

Bloodbeard:

Check my reply to your Batrep.  :)

TheFNG
Thanks for the advice TheFNG. You got my vote for general of the year.

500 p - The Blooded Horde
For an escalation campaing we are about to run we start out with 500p lists. Then after each round we can alter out list a bit and add 500 points to it.

Between rounds we can:
*Upgrade heroes to lords (daemonsmith to prophet) without them losing their XP.
*Change gear and items on heroes/lords.
*Add gear or commandgrous to units (never remove it again).
*Change number of models in a unit. Increase or decrease.

I'm gonna have to play 5 games with this 500 point list.

It's really hard to make a chaos dwarf LoA list with just 500 points - having to follow the three unit rule. Especially if you don't have access to any hobgoblins or wolfraiders.

So based on the miniatures I have painted up - and currently building a magma cannon - this is the list.

Hero
Zantromm the Aspiring
Daemonsmith
Lore of fire, enchanted shield, iron curse icon.

Core
Disciples of Zantromm
10 infernal guard, standard

Thunderbolts of Hate
10 infernal guard

Rare
Wrath of the Badlands
Magma Cannon

I all: 500 points

Tactics and thoughts
I thought about bringing a unit of 3 bull centaurs. But I saw a couple of problems:
1. Not enough bodies in the unit.
2. It's better to play with painted stuff.

A unit of wolfraiders would have freed up a lot of points. But I don't have any. And the models I plan to use doesn't come out before autumn.

I fitted in the magma cannon because that template has a chance of winning games in turn 1, when the units aren't bigger than they are.

Thoughts, comments and critique welcome as always.
18

Yodrin:

Magma cannon may win you the game in turn one in a 500p game for sure. Wolves would be also be nice if you had them. Have you thought about one big unit go IG with glaives, should be good in a 500p game.

19

Bloodbeard:

Magma cannon may win you the game in turn one in a 500p game for sure. Wolves would be also be nice if you had them. Have you thought about one big unit go IG with glaives, should be good in a 500p game.

Yodrin
I have. But I also need to follow the "minimum 3 units" rule. Rather tough in a 500 point game. At least if you don't have hobgoblins at your disposal.

But I could change the list. But I need to know:

10 infernal guard

or

3 bull centaurs.

The infernal guard gives me 4 more wounds for the points. The have same stregth (no points for GW or shield) and same armorsave (but IG has parry).

... I lean towards the IG. But I don't know have many VP theere'll be en BCs eating warmachines.
20

Yodrin:

I would also prefer 10 IG, but 3 BC has good speed and will often reach warmachines and take em out. Hmmm…no, I would give the BC a try;).