[Archive] Bring Back Chaos Dwarfs Petition

Archive [Archive] Chaos Dwarf Discussion
41

Thommy H:

What happened about that online petition from a couple of years ago?

cornixt
Nothing ever came of it. Which is what will happen to this one. Petitions don't work.

You want Chaos Dwarfs back? I suggest you put your money where your mouth is and start buying stuff to convert a Chaos Dwarf army and take it to your local GW store. I suggest you spend your time contributing actual content to this very website - write a story or a tactics article or some rules for the Word of Hashut, or start a blog to document the progress of your army. Demonstrate, in pixels and bits, how you're a fan of Chaos Dwarfs and how you're willing to spend money to amass an army of them. GW will never bring back Chaos Dwarfs unless they can be convinced there is an actual market to be exploited - and you can do that by voting with your wallet, not an online petition.

You want to support the cause? Stop wasting your time with letter writing campaigns and do something productive with the hobby itself. I see a lot of people wanting rules, but only a handful joining in debates about what those rules should be, or throwing their hat in with their own rules. I see a lot of people wanting new models, but only a relative few painting and converting figures to make that a reality for themselves and their gaming group. I see a lot of people asking about the background, but not so many working to create their own vision of what the Chaos Dwarfs are.

There is some amazing content on this website. There's artwork that rivals what GW produces in-house. There are rules that are just as good as any Armies book. There's a webzine that's as good as White Dwarf. There are stories and background that put the Black Library's glorified fan fic to shame. And, most of all, there are a lot of models that all demanded more money, time, care and attention than the models in any other army you care to name.

You come here wanting to start a crusade? Well we already started one. Not all of us articulate it in the same way - not all of us even care that much - but we all contribute meaningful things to this (dubious, silly, hopeless, but enjoyable) cause. And, if anything, that is what will bring Chaos Dwarfs back.

So please, if you want to get what you want, there are better ways to do it. There are ways that can benefit the community and entertain us all as well as fight the good fight. Petitions suck and they achieve nothing: by contrast, contributing meaningfully to Chaos Dwarfs Online is not only fun, but it may even work.
42

Obsidian:

Hear, hear!

Never found myself more in agreement with Thommy H untill now! :cheers

43

Ronshank:

I’m putting a picture of my Dwarfs in the next letter I write. And believe me they do notice letters. However I believe in trying to be a part of the whole. I buy gw figures to convert (you needed to if you wanted to enter tournament when they were allowed). I then convert them with other bits of GW models. GW has made a fortune out of me. I admitt I haven’t written for Hand of Hashut or been on Chaos Dwarf Radio but there are lots of things you can do to make your presence known. One of the easiest is simply playing with your army at as many places as you can or even just your local shop. Not to mention talking to the shop keepers as well as all the other hobbists you meet. However you are right if your good at fan fic write fan fic. If your good at dreaming up CD fluff or surroundings then do that here too. Bare one thing in mind though, not everyone thinks their ideas are good enough to share. Thats why some direct topics fail and yet others which ask for the same information from a different angle are beeding grounds for all sorts of ideas. As for coming up with ideas well lets just say you’d have to be a fairly seasoned player before you would feel confortable to do that, but some people are different and it’s easy for them, just not me.

If your good at writing letters write letters. We already know that GW are aware of CDO even if it wasn’t the most pleasent of aknowledgements. (Personally I didn’t see their problem as we were trying to get people to use GW rules and were promoting converting using their models, it’s open slather now…(yeah I’m a purist but I do love the ideas that have come from breaking away))

I do agree with you Thommy H but I don’t believe that writing letters is a bad thing at all. If nothing else we might be able to annoy them enough to give our army some more thought. Maybe even at least put us out of or misery and give us some detailed information reguarding our chosen army. We will look into it in the future is akin to ‘i’ll do it tomorrow’ when their is always another tomorrow and it never gets done. If nothing else they will at least see that we are passionate.

44

Thommy H:

Maybe I’m missing the point here, but what exactly do you want, here? They are never, under any circumstances going to create a set of rules and miniatures for Chaos Dwarfs right now. Are you trying to get them to rearrange the schedule for the coming months to accomodate a product range that they’re just going to magic into existence tomorrow afternoon?

Surely “we intend to do them again one day” is the best answer you can expect to get. Right now, Chaos Dwarfs are an official part of the Warhammer background and appear in multiple Armies books as well as getting mentions in the brand new rulebook. There are Chaos Dwarfs models in the current range and a unit of theirs appears in a current army (the Hellcannon). They’re more visible now than they have been in two editions of the game and one day, maybe, based on the success of these mentions, they’ll show up as a full army.

But it’s not going to happen soon. It can’t happen soon because of how GW’s schedule works - they have, like, the whole of the upcoming year’s product line set in stone already. The lead time on a new army is measured in months and sometimes years: if it’s not done already, it’s not going to be done for a while. This is just a fact of life.

So what are you hoping to achieve with this? Even if 6 billion people sign a petition, it won’t make them able to magic models out of the sky and I bet you can find more people to sign up to a petition that stops them delaying whatever they’d have to delay to do Chaos Dwarfs in the near future anyway.

They’re a company. Democracy doesn’t work. Vote with your wallet.

45

cornixt:

But it's not going to happen soon. It can't happen soon because of how GW's schedule works - they have, like, the whole of the upcoming year's product line set in stone already. The lead time on a new army is measured in months and sometimes years: if it's not done already, it's not going to be done for a while. This is just a fact of life.

Thommy H
They have pre-built gaps in their schedule that are a bit more last minute and not set in stone, plus there is background development work going on all the time that has no predefined purpose. So CDs could feasibly be dumped in sometime next year without disrupting anything else if they were motivated enough. It is unlikely to happen of course, and I don't see how reminding them that we are out here can ever be negative. A petition would never do anything unless it got support from nearly all of the other Warhammer forums out there, and even then it would probably be too small.
46

Ronshank:

Personally I don’t care if I do have to wait for a few years for it to come to the top of the schedual. I just want Chaos Dwarfs to be put on the schedual. I know that it’s not nice to admitt it but, for all the hope I have seen here amoungst the CD community in the last 5 years and all the encouragement we have gotten (and even some of the unwelcome attention we have gotten too) I just don’t believe that GW has ever bothered to put us on the scedual at all. Thats what I want changed. I want them to truely look at our armies merits and decide. I want them to either update our make-do army list or put us on the schedual to be made. At least if I am an example of how much GW make from CD Generals I know that it is not an inconsiderable amount. I say this because I cannot see this army flurshing forever-more if nothing ever gets done. They will lose out on money if our army becomes defunct. And hey if something is coming and we just don’t know about it yet then all the better, they will know that we will embrace a new CD army and know what it will mean to those of us who still wait for their decision on our armies future. Like I said petitions and letters do not hurt but they just keep us remembered by GW. I at least I hope. Which is why I try to be active about bringing that hope to fruition.

47

Thommy H:

they just keep us remembered by GW
They are remembered. That's why they keep getting mentioned all the time.
48

Ronshank:

Thommy H point taken but it won’t stop me.

49

Vash:

Thommy is right, the best way to get GW’s attention to them is to show your work in a store. A friend of mine is manager of a store close to me, he also plays in the same gaming group as me.

every now and then i go to his store to buy something, be it paint, brushes, some model kits, but every time i bring something to show.

the kids there are always positive about such things and take great interest in converted chaos dwarfs. they’ve usualy never seen them before (exept as hell cannon crew).

still sighned it though (because i just found the topic… i’ve been out of the loop for a while)

50

ingtar_shinowa:

im bumping it for newer members like me that havent seen it yet!

51

nitroglysarine:

Petitions don't work.

Thommy H
Disagree that they don't work in no way.
What they do manage to do is check how many other people actually care in the area, and raise some minor attention. Granted they are 99% of the time never a 'fix all'. But there are occasions.
EG:- A local train stop near Aberystwyth is reopening after a petition for the local community, it was cited AS the reason. ergo they CAN work, just they tend not to.
52

Thommy H:

Yeah, it works for things involving local government because local government is, by its very nature, empowered by local people. The council is elected by a democratic vote, so if those same people who voted for them want to enact a change, they have a duty to do it. That’s what democracy is. But a corporation isn’t a democracy: they answer only to their shareholders, and their primary (only?) concern is turning a profit. So you can complain all you want, but unless you can demonstrate the potential for Chaos Dwarfs to generate income for GW, they’re not going to just turn around and do it.

Games Workshop doesn’t owe anyone anything.

53

Nicodemus:

Games Workshop doesn't owe anyone anything.

Thommy H
They still owe me some bases as well as several White Dwarfs which never showed up!!
54

Thommy H:

Apologies:

“Games Workshop doesn’t owe anyone except Nicodemus anything.”

55

cornixt:

With this new Forge World stuff, the petition is outdated at best.

56

nitroglysarine:

Well and I think I still need a few dogs of war models that never arrived in 2002.

57

Tarrakk Blackhand:

They were good to me. I got a few replacement BFSP sets from ones that were screwed up and was allowed to keep the originals!

58

Da Crusha:

They were good to me. I got a few replacement BFSP sets from ones that were screwed up and was allowed to keep the originals!

Tarrakk Blackhand
That happened to my friend too.