Hulkster:
Hello I think this is my first proper thread here so I hope I am asking these questions in the right place.
I have been thinking about the hobgolin problem, i.e they are cheap and usful but the models are expensive and rare, and I was wondeing about a few things.
Firstly, are they really that useful? Can you make do with two blocks of CD, a unit of BB and a couple of large units of Orcs/BO? I am not after tactics really here just a quick yes you should have them, no you can do without kinda thing.
Secondly would you consider Gnoblars a decent replacment for them? or would Common Goblins with 6th ED Night Goblin heads be better?
I am no good with green stuff at all so I need an easy way to represent the little buggers.
Thanks in advance.
Kera foehunter:
well i think gnobler would be cool !! to add as hobgoblins!! if you check, i don’t think
no one here has the same groups of hobgoblins!!
Hulkster:
Thanks Kera
Gnoblars would be my first choice, as I love the models and it means I do not have to cut up my O&G
Swissdictator:
Since this is a dual question on Hobgob figures and tactical uses, I think you may have gotten it right. So have a drink! :cheers
As for the figures there are some amazing conversions. Tjub has done some amazing work with existing Goblin figures, I think Geckilian has done some amazing work with Empire Flagellants, and Ghrask Dragh has done amazing things with 6E Dwarfs… all are good… and I am only mentioning the first three that come to mind. There are many other good examples of work here. I’m sure you’ll find something cool!
I wouldn’t object to Gnoblars being used, and most people might be ok with that… ask some of the folks in your local group. Though I think they’d be a viable alternative. A small amount of conversion work may be recommended. Let me know if you want some Gnoblars and I’ll see what I can do.
I’ve also seen people just use the Skull Pass Night Gobbos. Just clip the spear so it looks more like they are holding a dagger strangely. If you’re willing some slight conversion of these can work. Plus it’s cheap, and will give you archers too.
Personally I think Hobgoblins are useful. For their cost, they are a steal. There are several ways you can use them
Archers. Personally this is my favorite roll for them. They are an amazing bargain. They add the mass number of shots warmachines can’t do, at the range the blunderbuss can’t pull off. All for a very cheap price! Plus you can put them in front of your blocks as a meat shield and if they run the rest of your army just laughs and doesn’t panic. It’s a nice tactic.
Hobgobs without equipment: A cheap disposable unit you can use to force an opponent to charge and redirect them into a trap… or to frenzy bait and flee in order to draw them off or deny a better charge… cheap flankers as well (think Empire detachments almost). Heck even the aforementioned meat shield isn’t all that bad.
Some armor for combat troops: I’d give them only a musician for command options. A standard is just begging for trouble as they’ll run often and it’s best not to give up those extra VP for a captured standard. However that musician will come in handy. If you’re going to give them armor, I personally say go all out and give them both unless you really need to skimp. If so, go for shields… they’re slightly better then light armor as in hth you get a better save. I haven’t yet tried them in this role, but even with armor and shield they are still rather cheap and are a bit better then Goblins for the cost.
I left the wolf riders out, as I assume you were asking about infantry.
My old list was 2 blocks of Warriors, 2 blocks of Blunderbuss, a block or Orc Big Uns, characters (including Lord on Great Taurus), and warmachines. My memory is failing me as to if I included Bull Centaurs or not. I personally liked it, but while the Big Uns were a little killy, I’m glad I’m upgrading to Black Orcs (after some shuffling of units.
At the very least, Hobgoblins are a great choice for getting some archers. I’m still trying to think how I can use them in other roles.
Hope that helps! Welcome to the site, may you find it useful in your adventures with Chaos Dwarfs! :hat off
Ubertechie:
Hulkster
As Swiss said they are fantastic units - 40 points for 20 of them is almost impossible not to take.
I use old night goblins but have replaces the spears with hand weapons - will be posting some pictures soon - but it is a cheap way to make them plus they look pretty good standing next to sneaky gits.
Gnoblars should be fine - especially if you are using them as naked (i.e. no equipment) hobgoblins
Hulkster:
thanks for all the replies guys
never thought using ol Night Goblins, I have a load from that old Fanst ybox set (4th I think) with the Night Goblins Vs the High Elves
I also have a load of archers from that set.
I might still go for Gnoblars but now I am torn between my old Night Gobbos and Gnoblars
Oh and with regards to wolf Riders I was thining about using them as a small baiting flanking unit later
I was going to use some gnoblars riding them backwards, holding onto the ears etc
@Swiss
You just sole me on units of Hobgoblin archers, not any easy thing to do in one post congrats. Do you think the old night goblin ones from the previously mentioned box set would be a good model?
Groznit Goregut:
I think a unit of 10 hobgoblins without any upgrades would be great to just put on a far flank. They can be there for capturing table quarters. They can either sit on your side (if you are castled in the other) or slowly creep across the field to the other side. They would gain 100 pts for just costing 20 pts!
Also, if someone bothers to go attack them or even shoot / magic them, then they are successful too! If anyone wastes resources to take out a 20 pt unit, then they aren’t shooting / magic-ing the rest of your army. It would be great if someone even sends some troops out to take them out.
Tarrakk Blackhand:
Hulkster…I started to Green Stuff my goblin archers to make them look like the taller Hobgoblins, and I only got to 2 guys before I gave up.
Instead, I decided to change the skin colour from green to yellow to make them look more like The Hobgoblin from the Spiderman comics. This way they’re still the same model, but the skin colour makes them look different from the regular Night Goblins.
As for weapons on the warriors, simply cut the length of the spear down to just below their elbow and then I cut off the spear head and replaced it with an axe head from a box of Dwarf Warriors. That gives them a weapon simular to the old Hobgoblins.
I also replaced my banners to make them hold something different from the common NG. I just used hobby glue and no greenstuff.
cornixt:
I’m guessing I shouldn’t have bothered writing an article about HGs for the new WoH, almost everything I wrote in there has come up in the last week!
wallacer:
I can’t imagine anyone would object to you using Gnoblars.
Just make it clear to them what they are at the start of the game.
Kera foehunter:
well you could use both. You could use the gnoblers as wolfriders
Border Reiver:
There’s not much to add here - hobgoblins give you lots of options to deal with a variety of jobs that your dawi zharr just shouldn’t get their hands dirty with. The only downside to Hobgobbos is the minimum unit size for hobgoblin wolfirders, but that is somewhat counteracted by the fact that our wolfriders, regardless of equipment are fast cavalry.
Converting them is problematic for some, but there are some really good examples in the Showcase and the converting sections. Using current minis such as gnoblars or goblins in a “counts as” role is perfectly acceptable - so long as it is clear what is counting as what and there no chance of confusion for either you or your opponent. Gnoblars are a perfect substitute for hobgoblin infantry because there is no other way that gnoblars can get into the list, and from a fluff perspective, the Chaos Dwarfs are supposed to enslave the little beggars anyway.
Astranagant:
Converting Hobbos is a big problem… but looking at Xander’s example, I feel that if I can convert up at least 2 HobBows, 2 Hobbos with Shields, and Command, I’ll just cast up the lot. Barring that Night Gobbos it is…
I have also considered using the EM-4 Orcs though… (I think they’re old Grenadier sculpts)
For the record, just buy the Wolf Rider feet… trying to sculpt even shoes while balancing the armature on the base is just a pain in the rear…
Hulkster:
Thanks for all the replies
You can all have a beer on me :cheers
I have decided to use Gnoblars because I love the models so much, though I am going to paint them Dark Green I think instead of grey. Though I am not dead set on that yet.
I will eventually convert some to have bows and I will be trying to make some amusing Hobgoblin wolf riders.
Oh and I am going to use Goblin Spear Chukkas with Gnoblar crew to make HobGoblin Bolt Throwers.
Thanks again and when I get back from Afghanistan I will start posting pics of the stuff I have done.
CheTralfara:
These are the many different Hobgoblin conversions and kitbashes that i’ve been working on…
Nekkid Hobs = Flaggelant Bodies + BFSP Nightgoblin heads
Armoured Hobs = Originally tried LOTR Orcs + Flaggelant Weapons… but I thought they didn’t look cool enough… and were too mono-pose… SO!..
Armoured Hobs = Now I’m building Marauder bodies + normal Goblin heads + normal goblin arms (yes my hobbos will have spears!) and normal goblin shields… The goblin arms prevent the marauder bodies from being TOO buff (which would be the case if I used the marauder arms)… Armoured tough slave hobgoblins should be buff in my opinion. The oversized plastic goblin heads are perfect sized on Marauder bodies. The marauder clothes look perfect for this chaos dwarf army of CHAOS. Especially since my army is a Daemon Binder Cult of Nomads… My hobbos function as cultists and warriors in my nomadic chaos dwarf army (they scour the howling wastes of the dark lands).
Sneaky Gitz = Skaven Plaguemonk bodies with their swords turned into downturned knives in both hands… + BFSP Night Goblin heads! sometimes I will greenstuff little booties over the feet if i think they look too rat-like…
Hobgoblin ARCHERS = Brettonian Archer bodies + BFSP Night Goblin heads! sometimes I will glue a small skull over top of the little shield icons on the brettonian archer bodies.
Hobgoblin ARCHER Wolfriders = New Chaos Hounds as wolves (with lots of GreenStuff fur added on) + normal Goblin wolfrider bodies (extended at the legs, added a bit of belly, remove the neck stub, and position the head more upright like a human.) + normal goblin bow arms BUT I had to replace the bow parts itself with a longer bow’s ends… because Hobbos do NOT use Short Bows they use NORMAL bows… in my opinion, this is the biggest problem with using stunted goblins/gnobs as hobbos… the fact that you will have to explain to your opponent that the Short Bows they see on your minis are REALLY normal size bows… I could see where that might be annoying… so I just change the bow ends to longer bow ends… but I still use the goblin bow-weilding arms.
Hobgoblin Armoured Wolfriders = New Chaos Hounds (with GS) again… + MOUNTED Chaos Marauder bodies (the new ones!)… I have to trim down the legs and re-greenstuff them a bit… so that they will fit around the “wolf” better. I give them normal goblin arms (again with spears) and normal goblin shields.
THAT’S A LOT of Hobbo Conversions!!!
.nick
Ubertechie:
Thanks again and when I get back from Afghanistan I will start posting pics of the stuff I have done.
Hulkster
Have a safe time out there
Kera foehunter:
well you have a lot of hobgoblin idea now good luck with them Hulkster
Border Reiver:
One point though, the hobgoblins aren’t slaves. The other greenskins are, but the hobgoblins, by siding with the CDs in the Black orc revolution, got a sort of “favoured nation” status. They are the overseers of the other slaves.
If you’re looking for a historical analogy, think client kings or nations of any of the old empires (Assyrian, Persian, Roman, etc.). The CDs seem to prefer to have the hobgoblins as willing allies, especially allies who are beholden to them for additional protection from the other greenskins.
Thommy H:
One point though, the hobgoblins aren't slaves.
Yes they are. Everything else you said is right, but they're still slaves. They don't get paid, they don't get to leave, etc.
Swissdictator:
At this point Hobgoblins are victims of their own actions… they tried playing both sides. They ended up play both sides against the middle, however they ended up becoming that middle… forcing them into a nasty position where they had to choose a side in order to survive. The Dawi Zharr won’t kill them simply for sport… while a Black Orc might. They figured it was better to be a favored slave than batting practice.