torn:
the problem is we would still be making money off of games workshops products, even if not directly. that is against copyright law and we all know how strict GW are with their copyright.
to do this without permission would be the quickest way to get this site shut down. has anyone tried asking gw yet? im sure there are phone numbers around for their head office, i used to have the number for a woman in charge o hiring sculptors but i dunno where i put it.
Grimstonefire:
Thats why it would be best not to have this linked in any obvious way to CDO.
If someone is to contact GW, I would suggest asking about ‘conversion kits’ generally, not even mention Chaos Dwarfs.��With only 2 sites that would narrow down the area for them to track us down a lot 
Would complete models be such an issue? How many people here would be worried about not using them in tournies?
torn:
i think anyone serious about playing in tournies that cost so much to enter arent the type to go cheap on making their tournie army. for the games like me who prefer to game with friends and at private clubs (not private mens clubs i assure you) i think full sculpts would not only be cheaper, but more realisable and cheaper for the gamer, who would actually be paying more for the dwarfs and then the conversion sets on top.
i dont want to sound negative in any of my posts but i just want my point to get through that it is a criminal offence to break copyright and can get you a hefty fine for something that may even be completely innocent.
Xander:
I still maintain my idea as the perfect solution.
Completely unique looking Demon Dwarves. That come With legs separate from backs and torsos.
Of course we don’t advertise them as Conversionable. Of course not. We have no ties with GW product what so ever. None. We could even ship with unique bases. 7th edition Chaos Dwarfs have not been even close to defined by GW. Even my Warriors barely resemble the Hellcannon crew. Beards and masks is all. But the scale mail looks nothing like a GW miniature. The brilliance lies in the bits orders and possible use combined with traditional dwarf plastics. This would not be advertised in the slightest.
In essence we create our own line of Demon Dwarves using our own trademarked look that happen to have a front part of a torso that could work, possibly, if you converted it onto an existing Dwarf.
This gets around any legal trouble, and makes the end user responsible for use, just like buying from a different miniature range. Also those who want full models can still order them.
WarplockMonkey:
Hey if you need a concept artist, im your man!:hat off
Hashut’s Blessing:
Mr. Xander, I’m pretty sure that what you say is you idea is actually posted by me a couple of posts before. if not, it was certainly my inetntion to So, do people want me ideas for sprues on here or not? (Obviously, we steer clear from the more CD-like parts, such as the hats I have drawn or something like that. And advertise the hobgoblins as Lackeys instead or something. Have them as a separate army maybe?)
grimsnikk:
Legally, GW could sue you for making money off of one of their products without permission.��It doesn't matter if you don't actually make money or that it forces people to buy GW products to complete it, they will sue you and they have a good case.Um, isn't that what companies like gale force 9 and others do?��the supertemplate, custom movement trays and magnet bases all spring to mind...
cornixt
Xander:
A very good point. Avatars of War for example. Clearly AoW (well, one guy) make models for Warhammer players. He even copies their likeness, yet he is going strong. So why would a likeness barely identifiable as Warhammer be targeted?Legally, GW could sue you for making money off of one of their products without permission. It doesn't matter if you don't actually make money or that it forces people to buy GW products to complete it, they will sue you and they have a good case.Um, isn't that what companies like gale force 9 and others do? the supertemplate, custom movement trays and magnet bases all spring to mind...
cornixt
grimsnikk
minty:
well, AoW’s owner still desings some models for GW so he gets some leway, and GW don’ have caopyright on movement trays and bases since it would be stupid to allow it since most where around before GW.
you see, they have copyright over all the things on the back of the boxes, not the general apperance of things so aslong as we don’t call thm chaos dwarves and mention warhammer theres very littlwethey can do
cornixt:
There are loads of manufacturers who use bases similar to slottabases. Have you found any that say “This can beused for your Warhammer models”?
grimsnikk:
In looking through the gf9 site, it looks like they have actually licensed products for GW, warmachine and wizkids. So nm, its licesend
Xander:
There are loads of manufacturers who use bases similar to slottabases. Have you found any that say "This can beused for your Warhammer models"?If/when we set up a shop, we will make zero mention of Warhammer.
cornixt
Ishkur Cinderhat:
I’d also make sure to call the minis “Dark Dwarfs” or “Demon Dwarfs”…
Xander:
Heck, call them Evil Gnomes.
grom:
If I could help then give me a tip
Grimstonefire:
I have thought of an example here thats useful to consider
http://www.coolminiornot.com/browse/page/1/submitter/scibor
For those of you not aware of Scibor, he is a godlike sculpter who causes us mere mortals to despair as we see our own feeble efforts
Anyhow, he makes a living by combining GREEN resin casts(produced with a machine like GW have), with greenstuff taken from moulds, with actual GW parts (and freehand sculpting).
He sells them as ‘complete’ conversions.
The sneaky part here is to not sell the parts seperately.��To convert complete models and sell them as finished conversions only.��Also to use greenstuff moulds and green resin so people can’t tell
So its more work, more expensive, but ultimately no hastle legally.
It would be the same as if we had sellers on here restocking units of warriors as they became available.
Oh, and don’t think people at GW won’t be reading this forums.��They do browse forums now and then.��So incase any such person is reading, we won’t be suggesting doing anything even remotely infringing on copyrights, we’re just looking at how else this can be achieved.
grimsnikk:
I think this is probably the best solution. Lets say, as an example: you were to want to sell chaos dwarfs with shields. You took a plastic torso and figured out the sizes so you could block out chain mail sections with scales. And you made those scales as separate resin pieces. and scratch built your own face/beard/mask front half. it’d be easy to produce, and easy to assembly line build, since you’d just glue in the 5 scale sections and then assemble it like a normal dwarf, although it would have a different front.
It’s really not that much more work. and as the models are actual GW models with conversions youd still be able to use them, and the people making them wouldn’t go to jail. works out for everyone!
Ishkur Cinderhat:
But the way I understand it you would then again sell conversion parts specifically for GW miniatures. Which they won’t allow.
Xander:
New plan, get this dude Grim linked to to make and sell them! Hahaha! This guy clearly knows what he is doing.
hal:
That scibor guy is incredible (nice avatar too).
I can’t believe that I hadn’t seen this thread before, it sounds like a great plan. I’ll be happy to help in any way I can.